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May 5th, 2009, 11:46 PM #1
"Detained" while OC'ing in State College
Post deleted by "poster"
Last edited by TheF00L; April 11th, 2010 at 02:32 AM.
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May 6th, 2009, 12:01 AM #2
Re: "Detained" while OC'ing in State College
I am too tired to break this down, hell I hardly could read it I'm so tired.
What was the PC to run your papers? TO take your property? They do not have to violate your rights because they receive a "man with a gun call". That's utter horse shit. I really doubt they are much more educated now than they are emboldened to do the same to the next OC'er due to your compliance. I will elaborate more tomorrow.
Sorry, but this was a BAD encounter. For many more reasons than it was good.Last edited by Pa. Patriot; May 6th, 2009 at 12:06 AM.
_________________________________________
danbus wrote: ...Like I said before, I open carry because you don't, I fight for all my rights because
you won't, I will not sit with my thumb up my bum and complain, because you will.
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May 6th, 2009, 12:01 AM #3
Re: "Detained" while OC'ing in State College
I cannot "understand the position the police are in."
The law cannot be any clearer, you cannot be detained without RAS that you have committed a crime, or are about to. The law is equally clear that simply carrying a gun does not constitute RAS. There have been ample cases brought, and much training conducted, that an officer has no excuse for violating the law and your rights in the fashion these officers did. An officer familiar with this site has even less ground to argue ignorance, not that that is an excuse.
No matter how polite, the officers broke the law, and did so knowingly and deliberately. They are nothing more than polite thugs."Never give up, never surrender!" Commander Peter Quincy Taggart
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May 6th, 2009, 12:02 AM #4Banned
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Re: "Detained" while OC'ing in State College
You were detained, you didn't break the law.
Sue the absolute crap out of them, the police and the movie theater. I'm sure that some guards at Dachau made friendly chat as they loaded the showers, doesn't excuse their behavior. You should have asked why they "detained" you, a legal term, when they knew you weren't breaking the law. And why they then searched you and disarmed you, again, when you weren't breaking the law.
Holy god I hope they tell you it was a Terry search, because then it's time to start picking out the color you want your new Porsche to be in.
Horrible experience, all in all. Sue the tits off of everyone involved. Sue them twice. Absurd. I've have left knowing the names of everyone involved, having their cards in hand, their voice on my digital recorder and I'd be blaring my lawyers ass out of bed the SECOND they "allowed" me to use my phone.
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May 6th, 2009, 12:13 AM #5
Re: "Detained" while OC'ing in State College
what are these no guns/no dollars cards you speak of? where do you get em?
ΑΣΦ
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May 6th, 2009, 12:18 AM #6
Re: "Detained" while OC'ing in State College
Please retain a lawyer tomorrow.
Their authority, assuming all in this post is accurate, IMO, was constrained to asking you to come with them, and when you got out of the theater, to inform you that the manager was too scared to ask you to leave and so they were being asked to do so. PERIOD. They had no cause to touch you, your shit, handle you firearm, or detain you. AT ALL. Everything from the moment you came out from the dark theater was a violation of your rights.
Please sue them.
ETA~ What position do you understand the police to be in? The position they are in is that, as "scary" as a man with a gun might be, unless you were doing something apparently criminal, they have no damn authority to detain you. Just having a gun doesn't meet that requirement. The damn training authority for the state has put as much in writing. Please, please sue them and then, maybe, this shit will stop.
OASN~I understand your feelings of standing up, I have had them. I still find myself second guessing my decision to walk away from the Little League encounter, instead of letting them arrest me. I also had the same shaking experience with PSP, and at the courthouse.
In this instance, you handled it the way you felt was right for you. But understand, they violated your rights. Please get a good civil rights lawyer... www.worthlawoffices.com ... tell them you're a member hereLast edited by headcase; May 6th, 2009 at 12:37 AM.
"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty
than to those attending too small a degree of it."~Thomas Jefferson, 1791
Hobson fundraiser Remember SFN Read before you Open Carry
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May 6th, 2009, 12:18 AM #7
Re: "Detained" while OC'ing in State College
They are here...
http://paopencarry.org/no-guns-no-money-cards
While many claim to support the right, precious few support the practice.
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May 6th, 2009, 12:32 AM #8
Re: "Detained" while OC'ing in State College
Ok, I took a shower and as such will be *half* awake for at least te next 15 minutes.
As Joe said:
The whole issue with this incident was that they had no RAS to detain you... and they knew it. 100%
If not they would have charged you.
The most troublesome part is that by complying with the ID request you just consented to being "fished" for RAS. They will claim they asked because they don't know if you are a hood. Of course that does not matter. They have to find RAS that you are before they can detain you. By asking for your ID they are fishing. Unfortunately by volunteering it (ID) you have effectively waived your rights unless they cooerced you.
Now I do assume from your account that you were not asked/or consented to having your firearm removed. If so then they broke the law in doing that.
Did they run the gun too? If so what RAS did they have that it was stolen?
(Az V. Hicks)
Ok, enough for now...
They did this to bully you into not OC'ing. because they do not agree with it. They even admitted it. They know damn well they could not detain you. The only good thing I see (other than the possible business owner education that I don't fully understand from your account) is that you told them you would continue OC'ing. As in, "No, you didn't scare me out of exercising my rights".
Like HC said. Get an attorney and really teach them an actual lesson. Like willfully violating the aw and citizens rights results in trouble._________________________________________
danbus wrote: ...Like I said before, I open carry because you don't, I fight for all my rights because
you won't, I will not sit with my thumb up my bum and complain, because you will.
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May 6th, 2009, 12:35 AM #9Banned
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Re: "Detained" while OC'ing in State College
Sorry but right here is the moment your rights were stamped into the ground. As 'nice' as they might have been they stepped WAY over the line here ... PERIOD.
Yes the business owner can ask to have you removed and that's the end of that. To be detained, searched and have your belongings removed? WAY WAY WAY over the line.
Time to lawyer up, period, nice or not these officers did NOT follow the 'letter of the law', in fact they walked all over it ...
This after we know for a fact the new training memo specifically went out of its way to alert these uninformed officers that OC is 100% legal. Well whether they 'got the memo' or not they should have known better ...... enough of this bullshit already
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May 6th, 2009, 12:37 AM #10
Re: "Detained" while OC'ing in State College
Yes they ran the gun too.
Now I am really unsure of what to do.
I just bagged my gun, 3 mags, Leatherman, LTCF, holster, anything they may have touched.
I am freakin shaking even more now. Going to take a hot bath to try to relax...
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