Help, I need the page and line number in 09 MPOETC for Philly carry!!!

[biggs88]

I am sending a letter to Ramsey about OC. I already sent one, and he replied everyone needs to CC in Philly.

I will post my letter once done. I would like to site the page and line number of the 09 MPOETC and the quote of what it says for him.
I have read it before, but the search is not helping me!!

Thanks All!!

[Dakota 35-1]

A little search goes a long way....

The actual excerpt from the update:

http://www.lildobe.net/PAFOA_Docs/MP...pdate_2009.pdf

The forum page it was found on:


http://forum.pafoa.org/open-carry-14...g-page-11.html

[mrjam2jab]

Page 45.....

[knighted4]

Also pages 46 and 47

knighted4

ARTICLE l SECTION 21
The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State shall not be questioned.
What part of this DON'T you understand?

[mrjam2jab]

right...i should have said "starts on Page 45"....and that would have also covered the 10 characters at the same time...

Biggs- It sounds like you're going to tell Ramsey where to look to find the info rather than try to feed it to him? I'm reminded of another post where poster was told by LEO "you can get anything on the internet"...

[biggs88]

Thank you GUYS!!!!

Here is what Im sending:

Dear Mr. Charles H. Ramsey,
Thank you for responding to my letter. In this letter, I am sending you a copy of what you sent me. Firstly, I am glad our officers will be up to date with the 2009 MPOETC soon.
The area that concerns me is this. In my first letter I sent out I wanted to make sure our police were fully aware that Open Carry of a firearm was allowed by law in Philadelphia as long as the person Open Carrying has a valid License to Carry. Your responce was ". . .responsibilities associated with a license to carry in the city of Philadelphia: . . . 2. The license holder will ensure that his/her firearm is concealed at all times on or about his/her person or in the vehicle."
While I agree carrying concealed is the smartest option in Philadelphia, I want to make it clear that Open Carry is not Unlawfull in Philadelphia as long as the person has a valid License to Carry. The reason I am writing this is simple. I wish to ensure our fine police officers are learning the law and enforcing the law and not someones agenda. I have provided some PA Law. There is NO PA law prohibiting Open Carry in Philadelphia as long as the carryer has a valid License to Carry, please ensure our police officers are aware of this.
I wish you and the department the absolute best while I await your response.
Thank you very much,
Stephen Schultz


I request you read page numbers 45 & 47 in the 2009 MPOETC book.
18 Pa.C.S. § 6108: Carrying firearms on public streets or public property in Philadelphia No person shall carry a firearm, rifle or shotgun at any time upon the public streets or upon any public property in a city of the first class unless:
(1) such person is licensed to carry a firearm; or
(2) such person is exempt from licensing under section 6106(b) of this title (relating to firearms not to be carried without a license).
Case Law:
Commonwealth v. Hawkins, 692 A.2d 1068, n.4 ("In all parts of Pennsylvania, persons who are licensed may carry concealed firearms. 18 Pa.C.S. § 6108. Except in Philadelphia, firearms may be carried openly without a license. See Ortiz v. Commonwealth, 545 Pa. 279, 283, 681 A.2d 152, 155 (1996)

Ortiz v. Commonwealth, 545 Pa. 279; 681 A.2d 152 (1996)(agreeing with appellant’s citation of the fact that "...in Philadelphia County, the legislature requires that a person must be licensed to carry weapons openly and not concealed from sight, whereas in all other counties of Pennsylvania, weapons may be carried openly without a license. . .

[knighted4]

Very nice letter.

knighted4

ARTICLE l SECTION 21
The right of the citizens to bear arms in defense of themselves and the State shall not be questioned.
What part of this DON'T you understand?

[mrjam2jab]

Thank you GUYS!!!!

Here is what Im sending:

Dear Commissioner Charles H. Ramsey,
Thank you for responding to my letter. In this letter, I am sending you a copy of what you sent me. Firstly, I am glad our officers will be up to date with the 2009 MPOETC soon.
The area that concerns me is this. In my first letter I sent out I wanted to make sure our police were fully aware that Open Carry of a firearm was allowed by law in Philadelphia as long as the person Open Carrying has a valid License to Carry. Your response was ". . .responsibilities associated with a license to carry in the city of Philadelphia: . . . 2. The license holder will ensure that his/her firearm is concealed at all times on or about his/her person or in the vehicle."
While I agree carrying concealed is the smartest option in Philadelphia, I want to make it clear that Open Carry is not unlawful in Philadelphia as long as the person has a valid License to Carry. The reason I am writing this is simple. I wish to ensure our fine police officers are learning the law and enforcing the law and not someone's agenda. I have provided some PA Law. There is NO PA law prohibiting Open Carry in Philadelphia as long as the carrier has a valid License to Carry, please ensure our police officers are aware of this.
I wish you and the department the absolute best while I await your response.
Thank you very much,
Stephen Schultz


I request you read page numbers 45 & 47 in the 2009 MPOETC book.
18 Pa.C.S. § 6108: Carrying firearms on public streets or public property in Philadelphia No person shall carry a firearm, rifle or shotgun at any time upon the public streets or upon any public property in a city of the first class unless:
(1) such person is licensed to carry a firearm; or
(2) such person is exempt from licensing under section 6106(b) of this title (relating to firearms not to be carried without a license).
Case Law:
Commonwealth v. Hawkins, 692 A.2d 1068, n.4 ("In all parts of Pennsylvania, persons who are licensed may carry concealed firearms. 18 Pa.C.S. § 6108. Except in Philadelphia, firearms may be carried openly without a license. See Ortiz v. Commonwealth, 545 Pa. 279, 283, 681 A.2d 152, 155 (1996)

Ortiz v. Commonwealth, 545 Pa. 279; 681 A.2d 152 (1996)(agreeing with appellant’s citation of the fact that "...in Philadelphia County, the legislature requires that a person must be licensed to carry weapons openly and not concealed from sight, whereas in all other counties of Pennsylvania, weapons may be carried openly without a license. . .

Corrections in bold...

[son of the revolution]

Thank you GUYS!!!!

Here is what Im sending:

Dear Mr. Charles H. Ramsey,
Thank you for responding to my letter. In this letter, I am sending you a copy of what you sent me. Firstly, I am glad our officers will be up to date with the 2009 MPOETC soon.
The area that concerns me is this. In my first letter I sent out I wanted to make sure our police were fully aware that Open Carry of a firearm was allowed by law in Philadelphia as long as the person Open Carrying has a valid License to Carry. Your responce was ". . .responsibilities associated with a license to carry in the city of Philadelphia: . . . 2. The license holder will ensure that his/her firearm is concealed at all times on or about his/her person or in the vehicle."
While I agree carrying concealed is the smartest option in Philadelphia, I want to make it clear that Open Carry is not Unlawfull in Philadelphia as long as the person has a valid License to Carry. The reason I am writing this is simple. I wish to ensure our fine police officers are learning the law and enforcing the law and not someones agenda. I have provided some PA Law. There is NO PA law prohibiting Open Carry in Philadelphia as long as the carryer has a valid License to Carry, please ensure our police officers are aware of this.
I wish you and the department the absolute best while I await your response.
Thank you very much,
Stephen Schultz


I request you read page numbers 45 & 47 in the 2009 MPOETC book.
18 Pa.C.S. § 6108: Carrying firearms on public streets or public property in Philadelphia No person shall carry a firearm, rifle or shotgun at any time upon the public streets or upon any public property in a city of the first class unless:
(1) such person is licensed to carry a firearm; or
(2) such person is exempt from licensing under section 6106(b) of this title (relating to firearms not to be carried without a license).
Case Law:
Commonwealth v. Hawkins, 692 A.2d 1068, n.4 ("In all parts of Pennsylvania, persons who are licensed may carry concealed firearms. 18 Pa.C.S. § 6108. Except in Philadelphia, firearms may be carried openly without a license. See Ortiz v. Commonwealth, 545 Pa. 279, 283, 681 A.2d 152, 155 (1996)

Ortiz v. Commonwealth, 545 Pa. 279; 681 A.2d 152 (1996)(agreeing with appellant’s citation of the fact that "...in Philadelphia County, the legislature requires that a person must be licensed to carry weapons openly and not concealed from sight, whereas in all other counties of Pennsylvania, weapons may be carried openly without a license. . .

Good Luck , but I wouldnt hold my breath if I were you . Ramsey isnt going to care one bit . He started his LEO Career in Chicago and then was Chief in DC before coming here . Having served the vast majority of his professional career in the two most rabidly anti gun areas of the Country , do you really think your letter is going to change his mindset one iota ? Not trying to piss on your efforts by any means . Just hoping your not planning on Commish Ramsey having an epiphany is all

[biggs88]

Good Luck , but I wouldnt hold my breath if I were you . Ramsey isnt going to care one bit . He started his LEO Career in Chicago and then was Chief in DC before coming here . Having served the vast majority of his professional career in the two most rabidly anti gun areas of the Country , do you really think your letter is going to change his mindset one iota ? Not trying to piss on your efforts by any means . Just hoping your not planning on Commish Ramsey having an epiphany is all

He can think and say whatever he wants. That does not change State Law.

I just want him to know educated people will not sit back and allow him and most of Philadelphia's higher-ups get away with poisoning the city with their agenda.