+1 for courteous, informed Allentown PD

[/dev/null]

I always gauge the situation first, before asserting my rights. The level of respect that the officer shows me will directly determine how I respond. For example (these are hypothetical situations):

Situation 1:
Cop: Excuse me.
Me: Yes?
Cop: What kind of gun are you carrying?
Me: It's a 1911.
Cop: Cool, cool. I stopped you because you just got out of a car with it... You got a license?
Me: Yes, sir, I do, right here.
Cop: Cool. Thanks, have a nice day.
Me: Likewise.

Situation 2:
Cop: Excuse me.
Me: Yes?
Cop: Keep your hands where I can see them. *pulls gun from my holster*
Me: Am I being detained?
(you know basically how the rest would go; I will comply, but do not consent, etc, etc.)


How the officer presents himself determines how I react.

Exactly.... I wanted to say most of what you did, but it was early this morning as I was posting and the coffee hadnt finished brewing yet. Besides, I know that others would get the general idea, especially those that have read some of my past posts about your demeanor. In a nutshell, act like a dick & expect to be teated as such.

[BimmerJon]

I'm confused by this conversation. He suggested you conceal to make his job easier and then said he wished more people would OC. Is that correct?

The cop was trying to play good cop/bad cop all by himself

LOL!

did he use different voices?

[son of the revolution]

The cop was trying to play good cop/bad cop all by himself

LOL!

did he use different voices?

Maybe it was Harvey Dent ?

[/dev/null]

I'm confused by this conversation. He suggested you conceal to make his job easier and then said he wished more people would OC. Is that correct?

The suggestion of CC was so as not to "alarm" anyone. He did say that they folks at WaWa could ask me to leave if they saw me whit a gun.... Absolutely was my reply - and if I didnt THEN he could escort me downtown on defiant trespass charges, but then again Im free to walk out the door and take my business elsewhere. I really think he was just making me aware that if I was going to OC then I had to be aware that I was on private property (and play by those rules). In our chat I mentioned TrueCrimsons encounter (which he wasnt aware of - or at least said he wasnt) and volunteered that I just came from Home Depot (which I OC in all the time). He didnt outright say he wished more folks would OC, just carry... it would make his job easier as the nefarious element would start to think twice before engaging in their trade.

All in all it was a great encounter. This was the first time Ive been approached by an officer (in over a year of OC) that I didnt know. Ive chatted with some DEA guys at a township meeting I was OC at awhile back - but I dont count that as there were also several local officers that know me well.... so I count that as amongst friends. the Synopsis is that he spends most of his time confronting the people that shouldnt have firearms, and wished he spent more time with the ones that are legally carrying - you've got to read the situation and handle it accordingly.

Just one of those soft skills that is hard to express in a forum, it all unfolds in real-time and your demeanor and attitude are going to steer the direction extremely fast. Somewhere in the conversation I even said that I knew I could have gone "am I being detained....", but then again, whats the point of putting him on the defensive. I greatly appreciated his respect and professionalism, why not return the courtesy?

Who knows, I might have found a new shooting buddy in the process

[PennsyPlinker]

Just one of those soft skills that is hard to express in a forum, it all unfolds in real-time and your demeanor and attitude are going to steer the direction extremely fast.

This is extremely important to note for anyone who openly carries. I know all the sentiment about how not everyone is an ambassador, but the truth remains that people who carry guns help create the impression the rest of the public has about - gun carriers! What a concept!

This is not to say that we have to be sweetness and light everyplace we go, and with everyone we meet, but sometimes it really helps, and it just might help the next guy too. We have extremes, like the Domelights thugs who point guns at law abiding citizens and then cover it up, and cops like the ones I meet regularly, who are friendly and easy going. It is up to the person in the situation to read that situation and respond accordingly. At the very least, they need to do it for themselves.

I think of the guy who got a ticket for being a hard nose about his encounter. Some people here just can't comprehend that he deserved the ticket anyway, and that a more pleasant demeanor might have avoided all that. But it works! And even if the cop is rude, what does one lose in returning civility for rudeness? Civility is not synonymous with weakness, and not even with compliance. I have been civil yet non compliant with police I have met. Some folks here ought to try it. Matt, good example.

[snakeman21]

Mine in red.

I know. However, it IS required that I have a LTCF to carry in a car. But the main point that I was trying to get across is that he was polite and respectful to me, so why not be polite and respectful toward him?

[ungawa]

Matt, thanks for the clarification. The additional info makes the story better, too. Now we just need to get rid of that carry in a car thing so cops can do real police work instead of approaching people because they got out of a car. I like that approach to helping cops more than the approach of law-abiding citizens changing their legal and peaceful behavior.

Cop sounds like a good guy, rep to you both. Nice story.

I've never had a cop talk to me when carrying. I have had many spot me carrying. Sometimes it's hard to tell what they know and when they know it, but I can think of many examples where cops knew I must have been going to or coming from a car. And one example, recently, where a cop saw my sidearm from just a few feet away, and then saw me get into a car. A car with Jersey plates no less!

[BimmerJon]

I know. However, it IS required that I have a LTCF to carry in a car. But the main point that I was trying to get across is that he was polite and respectful to me, so why not be polite and respectful toward him?

I hear you. We all have our "level" of how much we'll accommodate an officer, or anyone for that matter, during an encounter.

But, you also need a drivers license, insurance and registration to be in that car as well. That was my point.

Polite and respectful should be mirrored, but we read soooooooooooooo many threads about officers being polite and respectful as they search you car, question you for no reason, and remove your firearm from you too

[snakeman21]

I hear you. We all have our "level" of how much we'll accommodate an officer, or anyone for that matter, during an encounter.

But, you also need a drivers license, insurance and registration to be in that car as well. That was my point.

Polite and respectful should be mirrored, but we read soooooooooooooo many threads about officers being polite and respectful as they search you car, question you for no reason, and remove your firearm from you too

What if I was the passenger? I always am, right now, because my wife's car is the only one we have, and it's crap... Even she doesn't like to drive it!

[BimmerJon]

What if I was the passenger? I always am, right now, because my wife's car is the only one we have, and it's crap... Even she doesn't like to drive it!

lol, the cop still shouldn't have any reason to approach you.

Its nice to be chauffeured around