zeroing in a new red dot. I need assistance

[Andrew17019]

wow lots of input!


At 100yrds, all of my shots were anywhere from 1 to 7inches high from the bulls eye; however, Not a single bullet hit below the line for the lower half of the target. I figured it was because I was sitting, and perhaps i was shooting on an upward angle. I dropped my aim, by my account, approx 3 inches. All shots were once again on paper but a few were actually dead center bulls eye(no doubt by chance) and spread to all sectors of the target. For the most part all were on the target area with only a few hitting white no mans land.

Going back to the first reply of this tread. If the numbers given are accurate. If I sight the dot on a 25yrd target and aim dead center and set the dot so that it hits 2 inches low, wouldnt that in fact set me up for dead center at 50yrs?

As was stated by pretty much everyone, if you zero at 25 or 50 you will not be zeroed at 100. You have to figure out what distance you want to shoot most often and zero it again due to the distance and the fact that the bullet travels in a slight arc from the time you fire the gun to the time it impacts the target.

If your rounds are impacting on paper but are not grouping there can be a few factors. First, ensure that your sight is mounted correctly and there is no play in the mount. Also, if it is a 4 moa dot or larger then at 100 yards that is acceptable spread. Lastly, and most probably, it is most likely caused by the human error in firing your weapon, so as long as your rounds are hitting paper at 100 yards keep practicing and see if you can make your groups tighter. At 25 or 50 yards, regardless of how you are zeroed, you should be able to get groups at smaller than your fist or else at 100 yards you will cover the paper.

My suggestion is that after checking to make sure your sight is installed correctly and is not loose, bring your targets back in to 25 yards and just shoot groups until you are able to shoot a group smaller than fist sized. Once you are down to 2 inches or less move out to 50 yards and do the same drill practicing fundamentals.

[freeeire1916]

I am too lazy to research what the MOA dot size that Bushnell uses on their red dot. The dot size along with ammo weight will factor into those "ballistic tables" that were mentioned earlier. Since most AR15 owners typically shoot some sort of 55gr bullet, I'll assume that's what the OP is using.

To the OP, instead of trying to zero at 100 yards, I think you need to take a training course. You seem a bit new around firearms. Save your ammo and start practicing at 50 & 75 yards.

The only reason I tried zeroing from 100 is because that is what the directions on the sight recommended. The sight is 6 MOA by the way. I have done some reading on the MOA calculations and while it isn't an equation I am use to, it isn't rocket science.....or maybe it is .

I am not new to firearms as I have owned many hand guns and operate them quite well; however, this is my first rifle and a totally different animal. What would a training course entail?

[wa3ra]

I just broke down and grabbed a laser collimator from , of all places, Wally-World; about $40.

I verified it's calibration against my comm lasers, which I know are dead accurate; it was spot on right out of the package.

Following the instructions that came with the device, I checked both a rifle and handgun at 10, 25, and 100 yards versus the laser target. In each case, it instantly put lead on paper, and took almost no time to get the bulls eye.

On my XD, I was pleasantly surprised to see the two laser dots right on top of each other at 7 yards, so no surprises there. Setting the rifle up at 30 yards, using their offsets marked on the sighting target, it took all of 3 rounds to zero at 200 yards.

The BUIS, reddot, and front blade still all line up, but the pattern has tightened up nicely.

Bottom line; here is a great toy to get close without wasting ammo; yeah, it's a toy, but its a fun one.

[Pagoda240]

This is my cheap Red Dot Standing 25 Yards. Going tomorrow to move back to 50 yards.



p.s. i know my breath control sucks

[Agent Smith]

Here's what I did when I bought my Aimpoint COMP M4. I first bore sighted it the best I could before sending rounds downrange. I then went to my local outdoor range on a day that I knew wouldn't be busy and it turned out I was the only one there.

I placed the rifle on a shooting rest, and some sandbags under the butt. I wanted to take as much shooter error out of it as possible. I then proceeded to shoot one 5 shot group at 50 yards, and walk downrange to see where they were impacting. After making the necessary adjustments, I would shoot another 5 shot group, and once again walk downrange. I believe it took about 3 or 4 trips to get it completely zeroed for 50 yards.

It would be a hell of a lot easier with a spotting scope, but not all of us have one.

[Andrew17019]

Here's what I did when I bought my Aimpoint COMP M4. I first bore sighted it the best I could before sending rounds downrange. I then went to my local outdoor range on a day that I knew wouldn't be busy and it turned out I was the only one there.

I placed the rifle on a shooting rest, and some sandbags under the butt. I wanted to take as much shooter error out of it as possible. I then proceeded to shoot one 5 shot group at 50 yards, and walk downrange to see where they were impacting. After making the necessary adjustments, I would shoot another 5 shot group, and once again walk downrange. I believe it took about 3 or 4 trips to get it completely zeroed for 50 yards.

It would be a hell of a lot easier with a spotting scope, but not all of us have one.

This is the same way that I zero all of my optics, with the exception that with most AR's you can co-witness your iron sights if your irons are already zeroed, which will save you the boresighting step.

Spotting scopes are nice, and you can get a cheap one at Walmart that will sight in under about 200 yards. (I think I picked up a Simmons there for under $100). Your other option (and the one I use most frequently) is the sticky targets that create a colored splash or flourescent ring around each impact, allowing you to see them from a greater distance. These work great at 50, but are a strain at 100 unless you can see a lot better than I can...

OP, like I said before, with a 6 MOA dot you should be looking for a fist sized grouping at 100 yards from a bench rest (table/supported) position, when there is little room for human error. I would generally not recommend a 6 MOA reticle for shooting 100 yards, but it can be done. I have a 6 MOA red/green dot on my Sig, and it is great for shooting at < 50 yards. Just my recommendation, in my mind I have more fun shooting when I can keep my groups small anyway...if only because it makes me feel like a better shooter than I really am...

(in revision...)
I had almost forgotten I had a similar experience as the OP in zeroing a CMore on a 5.56 MSR STG this weekend. It was nearly impossible to zero at 50 and 100 yards, but was dead on at 25 and in (it was hitting paper at 50, and hitting somewhere at 100 yards. What it really boiled down to was that the CMore was an 8 MOA red dot reticle, and was really just not suited for shooting with that gun at those ranges. The larger the dot, the larger your groupings will be, which is why I usually stick with an EOTech, Aimpoint, Trijicon, or long scope for my shooting (personal preference, of course). What you described originally is pretty much exactly what happened to us this weekend, but I would definitely recommend shooting again under 50 yards and seeing how large your groups are to try to nail down the problem.

[freeeire1916]

Thanks to all of you,

Seems like I was a bit foolish for shooting my first rifle, for the first time, at 100yrds and expecting to shoot like a trained soldier.

I will take it down to 25 and 50yrds until I am able to get use to it.

Andew, you have offered input on several of my threads from the beginning of my red dot saga. Each and every time it has been helpful and educational. You have done it without talking down to me and have been respectful of the fact that I am new at this kind of shooting. I appreciate your help and the manner in which you have given it.

Thanks again guys

[Kaos]

Thanks to all of you,

Seems like I was a bit foolish for shooting my first rifle, for the first time, at 100yrds and expecting to shoot like a trained soldier.

I will take it down to 25 and 50yrds until I am able to get use to it.

Andew, you have offered input on several of my threads from the beginning of my red dot saga. Each and every time it has been helpful and educational. You have done it without talking down to me and have been respectful of the fact that I am new at this kind of shooting. I appreciate your help and the manner in which you have given it.

Thanks again guys

Once you've got it zeroed at 50 you can also learn your hold over/unders for other distances. I'm a fan of the 50 yard zero because it lines up with a 200yard zero somewhat closely due to the arc previously mentioned in the thread.

That's something that will come with time and practice, but it's probably a good time to introduce the concept as you seem to be getting more acquainted in general. If you've used this technique with iron sights before, it's the same with a red dot.

[Tomcat088]

This is my cheap Red Dot Standing 25 Yards. Going tomorrow to move back to 50 yards.



p.s. i know my breath control sucks

Lots of people are going to disagree about where you need to shoot in your breathing cycle. You need to pick one place that is consistent, it's obvious from the dispersion that sometimes you are holding your breathe and sometimes you are shooting on the exhale. I'm a precision shooter, and so I shoot at the "natural respiratory pause" at the bottom of your breathe. This means that you exhale naturally, and when you get to the bottom of your breathe, you start to squeeze the trigger and break the shot. If you haven't finished breaking the trigger and need more air, just stop putting pressure on the trigger, inhale naturally, exhale against, settle the sights, and finish squeezing the trigger again. No reason to hold your breathe and get the heartrate up, just relax and get in the rhythm of your breathing and settling the sights. Shooting on the exhale allows you to have a consistent amount of air in your lungs that is repeatable. You look like you actually have pretty good trigger control, so just relax, take your time with your breathing, and you'll have those groups whittled down in no time.

[Guns4Fun]

Thanks to all of you,

Seems like I was a bit foolish for shooting my first rifle, for the first time, at 100yrds and expecting to shoot like a trained soldier.

I will take it down to 25 and 50yrds until I am able to get use to it.

Andew, you have offered input on several of my threads from the beginning of my red dot saga. Each and every time it has been helpful and educational. You have done it without talking down to me and have been respectful of the fact that I am new at this kind of shooting. I appreciate your help and the manner in which you have given it.

Thanks again guys

The thing to remember here is that a dot site was never meant to be a precision shooting optic. It is meant to be a fast on target site for closer distances. At 100yds and 6moa, your dot is going to take up (cover) 6" of the target. So, even when you get "on" at closer distances, your dot is still going to be 6" in dia at 100yds. So, the best you'll be able to do is 6" groups - in theory. Keep that in mind.

It doesn't seem like you were too far off zero at 100yds though. I've sighted in a few aimpoints and eotechs and never needed to bore site any of them. I just mounted them to the upper and was always only a few clicks off at 50yds.

Good luck - to bad your an hour away from me. We could make a range day and get it all set up.