My experience of hunting in SE PAs Special Regs area

[Feddog82]

I started to type this post as a reply the "Views on Baiting" thread and then decided to give it some space. I typed this up b/c I felt that some people need to know why there are regulations allowing baiting in SPEC REGS areas. There are deer out the ying yang and there are not enough wooded areas to house them. The number of vehicle/mammal collisions in SE PA alone is astounding. You need to have population control. That is why you can bait and buy extra tags for antlerless deer. Not to make more cash for the PGC. To reduce the herd to healthy levels.

Now, there is no healthy number of deer that will work for every area of PA but that is why there are different WMUs and differnt regulations for several of them. I hunt an 8 acre patch of woods that is surrounded by suburban developments and strip malls in WMU 5D. That's right I said 8 acres. This 8 acres like any other patch of woods in SE PA has some of the thickest ground cover you can imagine. Many briars and other unwanted/unedible plants cround the forest floor. The only way to get a shot is to be lucky or place some bait as stipulated in the PGC regulations in the area of your stand. In special regs areas a hunter can have 5 gallons of any chosen bait at any time. Basically if a commissioner showed up and picked up all your bait it better fit in a 5 gallon bucket or you will get a fine.

I also wanted to share with everyone my experience of hunting in suburban SE PA and how enjoyable it can be even though it isn't as beautiful or as pristine as some other areas of the state. I hope you enjoy reading my account.

Here is a typical day in my stand so you can understand what "overpopulated" is, remember only 8 acres of woods in this situation:


Now picture getting into your treestand in the dark (5:30AM) hanging your bow and waiting for the sunrise. Now when the sun comes up (6:15AM) you can see several deer. There is a group of doe or what seems to be doe but as you inspect them through your binoculars it becomes apparent that several are button buck. As they move off (7:30AM) you count that there are 8 deer in that particular group.

In another half hours time you hear some crunching leaves (8AM) and notice that instead of the persistant squirrels it is a tight basket 8 point. He's your average 2.5 to 3.5 year old with the scrawniest 8 point rack you have ever seen. It makes you wonder if his rack is so small due to the high amount of deer in such a small area. They must eat up all of the nutrient rich foods quite quickly and then all they have left is low nutrient browse and the neighborhood shrubs/flower gardens. You let him pass and wait for the big guy as always. The little 8 moves off (8:15AM) and you think that maybe you should have taken the shot just like the previous 6 days that you have seen him.

You sit and watch the squirrels again; every once in a while a blue jay, robin, or cardinal will come through. You hear the distant honks of the canada geese on their way south and it makes you wonder if we will have a cold winter or a mild one like last year. Then as your mind is drifted toward thoughts of snow and a trip the poconos with the family the woods erupt with the sound of hooves trampling the forest floor (9:30AM). Your eyes scramble to see what the commotion is as several deer, perhaps 10 or 12, rush past your stand. Thinking that either a dog, a jogger, some teens playing paintball, or some other annoyance has buggered your spot you ponder packing it in and heading home for the day. Something in side says to stay and you settle in for at least another hour.

Snap! (9:45AM) The sound of a twig breaking lights up your senses and you look off to the edge of the woodlot. There a main frame 8 point stands with his nose to the ground about 10 steps behind a large doe that you somehow did not see before this moment. They pick up their pace toward you as the buck gives chase. The doe seems to be wishing for some alone time as she dodges trees and briars to elude him. But this buck is ready for love and won't give up.

The excitement then stops as the doe moves further from your stand and the buck continues to follow. You think about how the other deer scattered 15 minutes ago and how they must have been spooked by the show that you had just seen hot on their heels. You note the time, almost 10AM, and swear to be there in your stand to at least 10 tomorrow to hopefully get a shot at that nice 8 point. He had to have at least an 18" spread and six to eight inch G2s. This would definately be a step up from the beautiful 7 point you took last year from the same stand. Though that 7 point did have much more mass and a 20.5" spread.

Climbing down from your perch you think about all of the bucks you have seen this year and in years past. The racks seem to be getting small though you always let thesmall guys go. You have seen at least 5 differnt spikes in the past three weeks and only a couple of fork horns. There was a small 5 or 6 point yesterday but you didn't get a good look at him. And there is always that little scrawny 8 point. Hopefully he can prodice a nice rack next year.

On the short walk back to your truck you justcan't believe the amount of deer that frequent your quite little lot of trees and you're thankful that you have the oppurtunity to hunt so close to home. Perhaps you will get your shot tomorrow.

[Sandcut]

Excellent post! I may have to reconsider my comments in the related thread on baiting.

With that many deer around, do you really need to bait considering that they will most likely follow specific travel corridors. In which case, stand placement is almost as critical, if not more critical than bait placement.

Your thoughts?

PS. I'm just jealous that you're seeing deer!

[Feddog82]

In all honesty that is a typical day on my stand. As of right now the deer are not following any route in particular and they aren't on a tight schedule either. They were and thenI got al thrown off with the time change. Buck in general have seemed to be sticking to a schedule and the doe are running around like maniacs to get away from them. As usual the boys are ready for fun and the ladies are not giving it up. This week will probabaly bring about the rut for the doe but the buck seemed to be ready about a week ago.

As far as getting on a particular "deer trail" for stand placement I think it's tough to explain my situation. There aren't too many "good" trees for a stand as far as the logistics of hanging it or using a climber. Then on top of that you have to have some shooting lanes to go along with it. So I am stuck with two stands on the two small clearings in this particular wood lot. This gives me a 20 yard shot in all directions and a couple of 30 to 40 yard shots if the deer will stay still long enough in my shooting lane.

As far as bait an dmy methods. I use corn, carrots, or apples here and there in the clearing. Generally I put the bait out when I get to my stand for my evening hunt on mondays and thursdays. The bait will then last until the next baiting. I use 3 gallons of corn per baiting with random veg/fruit baits here and there. Most of the deer come in and eat through the night while I am in bed. For the most part the deer that eat from my bait piles are young doe and young bucks while the more mature deer keep their distance until nightfall.. Some may think that the deer that are showing on the bait are not what you would want in front of you. However as the rut nears these young doe on the bait will attract bucks with mating on their mind and the young bucks wil attract mature bucks trying to establish his territory. So in reality I am using bait to attract my "bait".

I must say though that I have taken 2 doe from my stand this year already to put some meat in the freezer. Neither of them were eating from the bait but they may have deviated from their route since they new there was food there.

[Dredly]

Still not going to change my views on bating but this is an outstanding example of how diverse PA is. I don't really care if "bating" is done on private land... what worries me about bating becoming legal is it will be done everywhere and then you run into "he is hunting my bait pile" and other related bullshit.

[Buckster]

With all the deer in the south east, and all the deer that get passed up, I wonder if the baiting could be providing the food source the deer herd needs to be so large. Is is possible that without the bait piles in the area that some of the herd would starve off far quicker than the hunters could kill them. Just food for thought I guess. Here were I hunt I have seen 1 deer during hunting hours. The PGC/ DCNR has a problem. I dont think baiting is the answer though.

[Dredly]

With all the deer in the south east, and all the deer that get passed up, I wonder if the baiting could be providing the food source the deer herd needs to be so large. Is is possible that without the bait piles in the area that some of the herd would starve off far quicker than the hunters could kill them. Just food for thought I guess. Here were I hunt I have seen 1 deer during hunting hours. The PGC/ DCNR has a problem. I dont think baiting is the answer though.

I doubt it, there isn't enough bait put out there to fully feed herds. Also in the area where this is if there isn't any bait the deer will just walk further into the yards to eat everything that grows... baiting isn't keeping them alive.

They should implement a doe kill required before buck kill in the special regs if they really want to manage the population. 1 buck can knock up dozens of doe... shooting the bucks isn't going to limit population. Forcing doe to be removed does.

[Feddog82]

I doubt it, there isn't enough bait put out there to fully feed herds. Also in the area where this is if there isn't any bait the deer will just walk further into the yards to eat everything that grows... baiting isn't keeping them alive.

They should implement a doe kill required before buck kill in the special regs if they really want to manage the population. 1 buck can knock up dozens of doe... shooting the bucks isn't going to limit population. Forcing doe to be removed does.

I agree with this statement and believe that implementing this would work. It would force the hunters to take a doe from the population before waiting for their buck. This in turn would reduce the "breeding doe" population. However then the PGC would have to establish check stations in the spec regs areas to check and catalog the hunters doe taken so as to keep them in check. Otherwise you could just fill out a doe tag and send in a report card and say that you had harvested a doe without actually doing so. So, that would cost the PGC more money and we all know what happens when something costs the PGC money and does not make them money.

[Buckster]

I agree with the doe before a buck is a good idea. Are there really people who only want to shoot a buck? If i was told I cant get a buck tag until I kill a doe then the first doe I see is dead. I guess I wouldnt be surprised if people lied about it. I guess there are all kinds of people out there. I have also thought about a trap and transfer program like they do for bear? We have no deer here, and you have too many there. Share the wealth.

[Feddog82]

We have no deer here, and you have too many there. Share the wealth.

if I could I would. All I can tell you is that if you would like to come down here to Delco for a Saturday hunt you are welcome to. I will put you in a stand or in a ground blind and you WILL see deer.

Maybe we can make a trade, do you have a bear problem perhaps?

[Buckster]

Sorry no bear problems here, not this year. Squirrels are another story though. HAHA