PAFOA members help requested for passage of HB 40 & SB 842:

[pointer]

this piece of legislation is worded in such a way as to be completely useless, utterly. Any literate person who actually reads this will see the loopholes and wishy-washy I am talking about

[eXceLon]

Not sure it's what your looking for...

Essentially, our position is that the current law is "broken" and that we are proposing a way to fix it.

Being able to provide examples of people who were harmed by the current state of the law would take it from the realm of the theoretical and turn it into something that people can actually sympathize with.

It's going to be hard to get people to want to change the law, if we can't demonstrate that anyone is harmed by the way it currently is. As the saying goes "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." So we need to prove that it's broke.

...but a Man in Franklin, Venango Co. was cleared of shooting a drunk crack head through his front door......

What do you mean by cleared? If charged were never even brought, then this doesn't really serve as a good example. If however he was subjected to a drawn out trial, having his name dragged through the mud, bankrupted by lawyers fees, and so forth by an overzealous DA for not other reason than defending himself... That's the kind of story you can present to the public.

Although truthfully, I'd be wary of making any "shot through a door" story the public face of any campaign. Even if it does make sense in certain situations, you're going to have trouble convincing the public of it.

[jengelh6471]

Excelon, This is my story, the invetigators report and my summary of how it affected me. And please no, How I should have done it or shouldn't have done it. The writing don't portray it as badly as it was. It's a big story but might interest you.

Letter to lawyer - http://www.mediafire.com/file/nijitjigtmd/Letter.pdf
Investigator -http://www.mediafire.com/file/ljimwzzzn3d/Invetigator Report.pdf
Letter from lawyer to prosecutor - http://www.mediafire.com/file/3kynw3gmdox/Letter

Letter of summary explaining how it affected me - http://www.mediafire.com/file/32tzxit2it4/Summary

[87th PVI]

The best part of this legislation to me is that it removes the ability of the bad guy or his family to sue you after your use of deadly force.
Currently someone can use deadly force to preserve ones own life & then lose everything to the attacker's family in a civil action.
That should NEVER be allowd to happen!
I actually think it's too soft as written & should include wording that allows/encourages the person who used the deadly force to sue the bad guy's estate & family for damages to his mental state after being forced to take the life of another human being!

[jetmech777]

Well I tried to help with your fight for HB40. I might not live in PA but it is such an awesome state I had to chime in nicely with my 2 cents worth.

The one thing I have to ask is How could you all in good conscious NOT pass this bill. It affects all of us.
You all as our elected officials took an Oath to protect and defend our great Constitution please now carry
forward and uphold that sacred trust so I may protect my beautiful daughters and most wonderful wife. Who
knows I might even be in the position to save your life and your family if you pass this bill.
How can these four points be bad things?

* The bill eliminates the duty to retreat within one’s home, including attached structures like porches, decks and patios. There is an exception for people who are using their property to further a criminal activity. The provision also applies to vehicles, including non-motorized vehicles.
* The bill also eliminates the duty to retreat on the streets provided one is in fear of grave bodily injury or harm, and provided they are not engaged in criminal activity.
* It provides civil immunity for actions that are ruled self-defense. If the perpetrator sues anyway, it’s a loser pays system, so you can recover attorneys fees.
* HB40 clarifies the definition of loaded firearm to include magazines being secured in a separate pouch, rather than specifying a separate container, provided the magazine is secure, and the ammunition covered.

Thank you for your time and consideration.
God Bless you all and America
Bruce A. Bell

[snow alergy]

I'll try please bear with me.



But, to date in both Texas and Florida which has a similar law this has been the only case of this type to have surfaced. Do we write law based on what people might do and since when is one occurence precedent setting? Is prior restraint now to become the legal standard in Pennsylvania?



Again in both of the populus states cited above what does history tell us? Where is the record of abuse of laws of this type?



Nor can any member of the District Attorney's Ass'n point to any case where these laws have actually made the streets and highways more dangerous. History itself argues against them.



But Mr. DA if you and the Police were adequately enforcing the law violent gangbangers would be in prison for long periods of time and so would the "tools" they use for making straw purchases. Each criminal arested carrying a gun has multiple firearms charges and sentencing enhancements facing him. But, for the most part the charges are plea bargained away and the enhancements rarely if ever used. Just for an example Mr. DA please name the last felon and the date you referred to Federal Authorities for prosecution under GCA '68? And if a prohibited person is carry a firearm isn't that a felony? And if a death occurs during a felony isn't that a murder? And isn't that murder outside the scope of this proposed law?



Back to history again. Are Pennsylvanians more hot tempered or murderous that Floridians or Texans? Overall, these are the same argument made when Florida adopted the so called "Make My Day Law", but the dire consequence predicted never happened.

But, beyond all of the DA arguments against, how about the protections given to the citizen against lawsuits by a crimnal injured by the citizen while attempting a crime. That is something that must be addressed.

I live in Florida and Pa both. And I was a full time res. of Florida before and a few years after it passed. It made things WAY BETTER... The bad guys know we don't have to retreat. They don't mess with very many who they percieve to be packin'.

I often work in high crime areas here in S. Florida. After the law passed my time there is much less stressful. No more challenges for the sake of challenging..

Also, under this law your vehicle is considered an extension of your home wherever you are. It worked here.
And no one is abusiing the law. Pass it in Pa.

[RedDawg]

got a response this morning to that bulk email link we all were emailed.

Mr. ______,

Rep. Harper received your e-mail and wanted to let you know that she supports HB 40/Castle Doctrine.

She thanks you for letting her know how you feel about this important piece of legislation.

Thanks,

Shannon

Shannon L. Bucher
Legislative Aide
District Office of State Representative Kate Harper

just thought it was interesting, i wasn't expecting a response at all.