National Guard to help with G20 security

[RJT]

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt.../s_641719.html

The Pennsylvania National Guard expects to patrol Downtown during the Group of 20 economic summit, but doesn't yet know exactly what role it will play in securing the meeting sites, an official said Friday.

Troops expect Gov. Ed Rendell to call up the guard under U.S. Code Title 32, which means it will be subject to the control and orders from Harrisburg, but paid for by the federal government, said Pennsylvania National Guard Lt. Col. Chris Cleaver.

"It's the same type of orders we would operate under if we were called to provide security for the presidential inauguration in Washington, D.C., or for a large political convention in Philadelphia," Cleaver said.

Casey Capitolo, organizer for the Three Rivers' Convergence group of environmentalists, decried the idea of using soldiers in the city.

"Are we militarizing our city for a whole week before the G-20? Is that sending an intimidating message to our citizens by putting soldiers on our street corners?

"I'll answer that. This is not Fallujah or Tehran. This is Pittsburgh. The troops aren't necessary," said Capitolo, who earlier this week spoke out against proposed rules for G-20 protesters during a City Council hearing.

Rendell's press office referred all questions to the National Guard.

Cleaver said guard leaders met with local officials working in summit planning committees to discuss security for the Sept. 24-25 meeting of world leaders at the David L. Lawrence Convention Center, Downtown. Planners expect the summit to attract thousands of protesters and journalists.

That will mean some type of security perimeter around the convention center and other meeting sites.

Pittsburgh police, working with the Secret Service, are planning to bring in 3,100 officers to augment the city's 900 officers. Leaders have not announced where the security perimeters will be and which streets, bridges or tunnels will be affected.

Cleaver said he expects a National Guard presence on a smaller scale of what President Obama's inauguration festivities required in January, when 10,000 Army and Air National Guard troops provided support to tens of thousands of police officers. The number of National Guard troops needed for the G-20 would likely be closer to 2,000, Cleaver said.

He said troops would provide foot patrols, traffic and crowd control around the convention center and could include a "civil support team" or "emergency response forces" trained to respond to attacks or acts of terrorism. The presence might also include the use of Humvees and helicopters, Cleaver said.

"This would be a pretty routine mission for us, the same as we've been called out before to provide security for events including the Little League World Series," Cleaver said.

[YllwFvr]

I will freely admit I'm ignorant when it comes to this but wouldn't posse comitatus (sp?) come into play here? Isn't that troops won't be used to patrol the streets??

[ChamberedRound]

I believe this is actually OK as far as Possee Comitatus is concerned, as the PANG is not a federal military force, it's managed by the Governor.

[PisnNapalm]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act

The Posse Comitatus Act is a United States federal law (18 U.S.C. § 1385) passed on June 18, 1878, after the end of Reconstruction, with the intention (in concert with the Insurrection Act of 1807) of substantially limiting the powers of the federal government to use the military for law enforcement. The Act prohibits most members of the federal uniformed services (today the Army, Air Force, and State National Guard forces when such are called into federal service) from exercising nominally state law enforcement, police, or peace officer powers that maintain "law and order" on non-federal property (states and their counties and municipal divisions) within the United States.

The statute generally prohibits federal military personnel and units of the National Guard under federal authority from acting in a law enforcement capacity within the United States, except where expressly authorized by the Constitution or Congress. The Coast Guard is exempt from the Act during peacetime.

[stephpd]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act

Exactly. The National Guard has been busy fighting in the two wars. Prior to this they were more a state thing. But Bush ran short on manpower for the wars and pretty much federalized them.

[Adam-12]

Exactly. The National Guard has been busy fighting in the two wars. Prior to this they were more a state thing. But Bush ran short on manpower for the wars and pretty much federalized them.

Yup. But when they're under state orders, they're technically not violating posse comitatus.

But it's mighty interesting that they're using cops from DC and Chicago--both gun-free zones with a history of cop-on-civilian violence--and they're using the national guard, but they're not using PA State Constables. Who needs a local, elected peace officer when you can use soldiers with rifles? Especially when you're less interested in keeping the peace, and more interested in shocking and awing the peasants with your power.

[archangel689]

As if shit couldn't get any worse. How do I know any of these people aren't going to start randomly breaking into houses (ie: my house).

I am definitely getting the hell out of here for this one. Amazingly, my company is completely oblivious to the danger. No mention of any precautions for that day. In a week or so I will be informing them that I will be absent.

[mjf]

Nobody keeps the peace better than the national guard. Just look at Kent State... It's not like their a force trained for killing people or something, if they were using them for peace keeping would be silly.

[knight0334]

I will freely admit I'm ignorant when it comes to this but wouldn't posse comitatus (sp?) come into play here? Isn't that troops won't be used to patrol the streets??

The National Guard is a state run militia with the Governor as Commander in Chief until it is federalized. Only those soldiers and units called into actual service for the federal government are federalized. All other soldiers and units still remain state controlled.

[phill]

Nobody keeps the peace better than the national guard. Just look at Kent State... It's not like their a force trained for killing people or something, if they were using them for peace keeping would be silly.

A lot has been learned since Kent State. The troops had been left on the front line for hours and had been taunted and had various things thrown at them. Is this an excuse for their reaction no, but most who are left in this situation too long will tend to over react.
Spent some time in a similar situation and can tell you that your fuse gets very short. After being spit on and having dodged rocks and bottles of ?, you need to be rotated back and allowed to cool off.
Once again no excuses just an explanation.