DPW no gun posting!

[hgsw67]

Today i went to the local DPW for assistance with the grandaughter. In the outside vestibule I found the following notice:

FIREARMS AND OTHER WEAPONS NOTICE

the possesion and/or use of firearms, ammunition, weapons,explosives, flammables or other implements or believable reproductions readily capable of qand intended top do harmon another person or property is strictly prohited on DPW property, including in personal vehicles in parking lots and on grounds. This includes but not limited to:

RIFLES, AUTOMATIC WEAPONS,HANDGUNS, SHOTGUNS, AIR GUNS, STUN GUNS, FLARE GUNS, BOW & ARROW COMBINATIONS, OR OTHER MISSILE PROPELLING DEVICES, INCENDIARY OR EXPLOSIVE DEVICES, CLUBS, MARTIAL ARTS WEAPONS, TEAR GAS, SWITCHBLADES, DAGGERS OR KIVES WITH THREE INCH OR LONGER BLADES.

ALL VIOLATIONS OF THIS POLICY WILL BE REFERRED TO THE APPROPRIATE AGENCY HEAD TO ENSURE ACTION IS TAKEN AS NECCESSARY. vIOLATIONS OF LAW WILL BE REPORTED TO APPROPRIATE LAW ENFORCEMENT AUTHORITIES.

Now!!, I have no knowledge of whether the property is owned or leased by any particular party, be it private or public. Just found it interesting in that it was typed up on regular paper, no letterhead for the agency, and no signature of any responsible party. BTW, spotted this on the way out of the building after taking care of business while cc'ing, and probably badly cc'ing at that. Dont really think this is legal but i found the poor quality wording to be very amusing.
Unfortunately, right now i need them more than they need me, so i will abide by their "policy" until I have finished my business with them. If anyone not associated with my case wants to pick up the banner, PM me and I'll give you the location of this office.
hgsw67

[JCWohlschlag]

The Department of Public Welfare is a state agency that has the authority to create and enforce its own regulations. Such regulations can be found in Title 55 (Public Welfare) of the Pa. Code:

• Part IV. Adult Services Manual
  
  • Subpart E. Residential Agencies/Facilities/Services
    
    • Chapter 2600. Personal Care Home Licensing
      
      • § 2600.108. Firearms and weapons.

• Part V. Children, Youth, and Families Manual
  
  • Subpart D. Nonresidential Agencies, Facilities and Services
    
    • Article I. Licensing/Approval
      
      • Chapter 3270. Child Day Care Centers
        
        • § 3270.79. Firearms.

• Part V. Children, Youth, and Families Manual
  
  • Subpart D. Nonresidential Agencies, Facilities and Services
    
    • Article I. Licensing/Approval
      
      • Chapter 3280. Group Child Day Care Homes
        
        • § 3280.79. Firearms.

• Part V. Children, Youth, and Families Manual
  
  • Subpart D. Nonresidential Agencies, Facilities and Services
    
    • Article I. Licensing/Approval
      
      • Chapter 3290. Family Child Day Care Homes
        
        • § 3290.76. Firearms.

• Part V. Children, Youth, and Families Manual
  
  • Subpart E. Residential Agencies, Facilities and Services
    
    • Article I. Licensing/Approval
      
      • Chapter 3800. Child Residential and Day Treatment Facilities
        
        • § 3800.101. Firearms and weapons.

• Part VIII. Mental Retardation Manual
  
  • Subpart E. Residential Agencies/Facilities/Services
    
    • Article I. Licensing/Approval
      
      • Chapter 6400. Community Homes for Individuals with MentalRetardation
        
        • § 6400.86. Firearms.

• Part VIII. Mental Retardation Manual
  
  • Subpart E. Residential Agencies/Facilities/Services
    
    • Article I. Licensing/Approval
      
      • Chapter 6500. Family Living Homes
        
        • § 6500.84. Firearms.

So, depending on where this place was, it may very well be a legal prohibition and not subject to state preemption.

[schr8er2000]

I tend to disagree.. preemption does apply here... and the only places restricted ( other than private property ) is spelled out by the state..... I would call and ask about this and make it a point to specify the fact that only the state of PA can restrict the locations of public property where one can and cannot carry.

[fingers80002]

I tend to disagree.. preemption does apply here... and the only places restricted ( other than private property ) is spelled out by the state..... I would call and ask about this and make it a point to specify the fact that only the state of PA can restrict the locations of public property where one can and cannot carry.

Looks like Preemption rules here!

[JCWohlschlag]

I tend to disagree.. preemption does apply here... and the only places restricted ( other than private property ) is spelled out by the state..... I would call and ask about this and make it a point to specify the fact that only the state of PA can restrict the locations of public property where one can and cannot carry.

The Department of Public Welfare is a state agency given the power to enact and enforce regulations by state statute.

The provisions of this [Pa. Code] Chapter 2600 issued under section 211 and Articles IX and X of the Public Welfare Code (62 P.S. §§ 211, 901–922, and 1001–1087), unless otherwise noted.

The provisions of this [Pa. Code] Chapter 3270 issued under Articles IX and X of the Public Welfare Code (62 P.S. §§ 901–922 and 1001–1087), unless otherwise noted.

The provisions of this [Pa. Code] Chapter 3280 issued under Articles IX and X of the Public Welfare Code (62 P.S. §§ 901–922 and 1001–1087), unless otherwise noted.

The provisions of this [Pa. Code] Chapter 3290 issued under Articles IX and X of the Public Welfare Code (62 P.S. §§ 901–922 and 1001–1087), unless otherwise noted.

The provisions of this [Pa. Code] Chapter 3800 issued under Articles IX and X of the Public Welfare Code (62 P.S. §§ 901–922 and 1001–1080), unless otherwise noted.

The provisions of this [Pa. Code] Chapter 6400 issued under the Public Welfare Code (62 P.S. § 1021); amended under Article X of the Public Welfare Code (62 P.S. §§ 1001–1080), unless otherwise noted.

The provisions of this [Pa. Code] Chapter 6500 issued under Article X of the Public Welfare Code (62 P.S. §§ 1001–1080), unless otherwise noted.

This is a situation similar to the Department of Conservation and Natural Resources (DCNR) being able to prohibit the open carry of firearms within a state park in 17 Pa. Code § 11.215 under the authority granted to them by 71 P.S. § 1340.313, part of the Conservation and Natural Resources Act. Regulations found in the Pa. Code are still state regulations under the authority of various state statutes, and are not subject to preemption.

As long as the facility in the original post falls under the purview of one of the previously cited Pa. Code sections, they’re binding.

[Statkowski]

Preemption DOES NOT APPLY here. If you look at Section 6120(a), it states that counties, municipalities or townships may not regulate firearms. The Department of Public Welfare is a State agency, part of the Executive Branch. As such, it is above preemption.

However, since the various code sections listed under the DPW regulations do not mention DPW offices, the posting is still unlegal (it's not illegal since it's not in violation of any statute or code, but it is unlegal since it's not backed up by any statute or code).

Recommendation: File a Right-to-Know-Law request with that particular DPW office, asking for the statute or code authorizing the posting of such a notice.

[redeye202]

Guys,i think he means Department Of Public Works, roads,sanitation,sewers,ect.
redeye202

[JCWohlschlag]

Guys,i think he means Department Of Public Works, roads,sanitation,sewers,ect.
redeye202

Unless the original poster lost his/her granddaughter in a trash can or a sewer, I think the Department of Public Welfare makes more sense.

Today i went to the local DPW for assistance with the grandaughter.

(Now you all see why I shy away from abbreviations, if anyone was wondering.)

[redeye202]

Ok hgsw67,what DPW is it? lol.
redeye202

[sleeper78]

Either way, state agencies can decide what is allowed on their properties. I work for the DOC and we have a boat load of regs pertaining to what is and isn't allowed on state property and Weapons is on the top of the list. As a state agency they can do as they please as they are the state.