Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Question Civil War Enfield v. Springfield

    I'm thinking about getting a Civil War uniform and musket w/ bayonet and I have been told to get either a 3 band Enfield or a 3 band Springfield. I was checking them out at the Regimental Quartermaster. Any recommendations? Also I see that there are two manufacturers listed ArmiSport and EuroArms. Are either one of those better than the other or the same? Thanks for your feedback.

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    Default Re: Civil War Enfield v. Springfield

    Quote Originally Posted by Solo View Post
    I'm thinking about getting a Civil War uniform and musket w/ bayonet and I have been told to get either a 3 band Enfield or a 3 band Springfield. I was checking them out at the Regimental Quartermaster. Any recommendations? Also I see that there are two manufacturers listed ArmiSport and EuroArms. Are either one of those better than the other or the same? Thanks for your feedback.
    Congratulations, you made the first move correctly. You asked questions before plopping cash down.

    What you buy will be affected by what you use them for. If you re-enact, you'll likely buy what the unit dictates...at least at first.

    In my case, I teach a short seminar on Pennsylvania gun making history, so I'm on the constant lookout for early PA made guns. In your context, I contracted James River Armory to make an M1861 pattern musket by James Rice, PHILADELPHIA marked. I think it started out as mostly Euroarms parts & a Hoyt barrel. Here are a few clickable images:

    - - - -

    Since it sounds like you're re-enacting, look into a good outfit that de-farbs, Zimmerman & JRA offer complete guns, ready-to-go. Regimental QM doesn't defarb, they are a reseller just like Fall Creek, et al.

    If you're looking for something fun, or don't have any historical concerns, you're free to get just about anything.
    - -
    Last edited by PA Rifleman; February 17th, 2009 at 08:49 PM. Reason: photo URL fixed [duh]
    Gloria: "65 percent of the people murdered in the last 10 years were killed by hand guns"
    Archie Bunker: "would it make you feel better, little girl, if they was pushed outta windows?"

    http://www.moviewavs.com/TV_Shows/Al...he_Family.html

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Civil War Enfield v. Springfield

    Thanks PA Rifleman. I was looking into it more as a ceremonial thing than as a re-enactor. I was thinking of joining the Sons of Veterans Reserve and was checking out the website of their closest unit to me which is about 44 miles away. They listed what I would need as far as a uniform and musket but didn't really go into much detail. Then as I looked into the stuff I was finding out about machine sewn button holes versus handsewn ones etc. I think to start I would probably get a cheaper musket since I wouldn't really be using it much except for maybe Memorial Day. The SVR website didn't mention defarbing but I'm sure that if I got into it they would expect it. It's a lot to learn about all at once. Thanks again.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Civil War Enfield v. Springfield

    PA Rifleman provided a good rundown of options for high quality reenacting arms; I second his recommendation of Zimmerman for de-farbing, if you want to go that route. Sounds like you just want a decent repro to use for living history events, not necessarily a thoroughly defarbed musket that's identical to an original. You might want to check with the SVR unit you're planning on joining to see if they have a preference -- I was in the 28th PA in Philly several years ago, and they allowed members to use the musket of their choice. So it likely will come down to your preference, and both ArmiSport and EuroArms are good makers. If you go to a meeting of your local SVR unit or to an event they run, you can check them out and see what you prefer. Also, George Lomas at Reg. Quartermaster often opens up his barn on weekends during the off-season to sell goods locally; you might want to give him a call and see if he will be open anytime coming up soon. He also travels to all the major skirmishes and reenacting events.

    Last but not least, check out the board at the North-South Skirmish Association for any used muskets that may be available: http://www.n-ssa.org/phpbb/viewforum.php?f=3. If you ever want to try target shooting with your musket, the N-SSA is the place to go. Best of luck.

    PA Rifleman, that's a nice-looking musket you have there. I heard James River Armory made nice pieces but I've never seen one up close.

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    Default Re: Civil War Enfield v. Springfield

    Quote Originally Posted by shiloh View Post
    ... Also, George Lomas at Reg. Quartermaster often opens up his barn on weekends during the off-season to sell goods locally; you might want to give him a call and see if he will be open anytime coming up soon. He also travels to all the major skirmishes and reenacting events.
    http://www.regtqm.com/

    I recall he prefers to point people to his Gettysburg facility.

    I stopped in about 5-10 years ago, I was like a kid in a candy store. He was located here, as I recall.
    Quote Originally Posted by shiloh View Post
    Last but not least, check out the board at the North-South Skirmish Association for any used muskets that may be available: http://www.n-ssa.org/phpbb/viewforum.php?f=3.
    Good lord, what have you wrought? I'll need to cook up a multi-billion Wall St scheme now that I've seen that place!
    Quote Originally Posted by shiloh View Post

    PA Rifleman, that's a nice-looking musket you have there. I heard James River Armory made nice pieces but I've never seen one up close.
    I had a nice, long post but Firefox crashed...taking all the links I typed with it..[x^(

    Long story short, the main reason why I'd consider Zimmerman now is JRA's focusing on W.W.II, Zimmerman's still CW dedicated. I spoke with JRA a year or two back re: custom lock markings (Mill Creek, Daniel Nippes) and he was scaling back even then.

    I have an A-S M1842 rifled musket, if I defarb, I'll likely contact Zimmerman to do the work. He still lists his defarb at $40, the round trip shipping will exceed this.
    Gloria: "65 percent of the people murdered in the last 10 years were killed by hand guns"
    Archie Bunker: "would it make you feel better, little girl, if they was pushed outta windows?"

    http://www.moviewavs.com/TV_Shows/Al...he_Family.html

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Civil War Enfield v. Springfield

    I was checking out the website for the 28th and that is where it said to get a 3 band Enfield or a 3 band Springfield. I assumed that if I joined the SVR they would put me with the 28th since they are the closest although it is still 44 miles away from me. They don't have a member at large category do they?

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    Default Re: Civil War Enfield v. Springfield

    Solo, here's the deal as I recall it -- you can join the 28th PA reenacting unit initially without joining the Sons of Veterans Reserve, although all the guys who do military reenacting in the unit are in the SVR and I think you're required to join after a year. So the SVR (Anna M. Ross Camp No. 1) and the 28th are largely the same outfit, at least for reenacting purposes. When I was a member they met in the old GAR museum on Griscom Street in Frankford section of Philadelphia, I don't know if they still do. Also, you don't have to buy gear right away -- they always have spare sets of uniforms, leathers, muskets and other gear for "fresh fish" who want to try it out before laying out a lot of money on their own gear. The 28th always runs a reenacting event at Neshaminy State Park in April of each year; if you don't know anyone in the unit that's a great place to check it out, talk to the guys and give it a try. Best bet is to email the unit using the contact info at www.28thpvi.org and tell them your interests. They;ll set you up.

    PA Rifleman, it's been at least 10 years since I've been to George's local place, if memory serves me right it was right off of County Line Road on the Hatboro/Warminster border. Could be he's moved; like I said it's been many years. You're right, he likely prefers people to go online or to Gettysburg or at an event. he's a great guy and has great stuff.

    I was a member of the N-SSA for several years and really enjoyed it -- that member board is a great place for deals on original and repro CW arms. You can spend a lot of time (and money) there!! And if you like to see what those Civil War guns can do in the right hands, there's nothing better than going to an N-SSA skirmish, particularly the nationals down in Winchester, VA.

    Love that big ole '42 smoothbore. I have an original, first year of issue (1844 dated). Also have several other original and repro Civil War arms, when I have some time in the next few days I'll post pix of them. Nice to see some other Civil War era shooters on this forum

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    Default Re: Civil War Enfield v. Springfield

    Quote Originally Posted by shiloh View Post
    ...

    Love that big ole '42 smoothbore. I have an original, first year of issue (1844 dated). Also have several other original and repro Civil War arms, when I have some time in the next few days I'll post pix of them. Nice to see some other Civil War era shooters on this forum
    Thanks, if you're referring to the '42, she's a spinner...or at least that's supposed to happen...
    -

    Back to the foundry with softer lead, I guess. BTW, here' my 69 cal smoothie, made right here in Penna. Would appreciate anyone's insight on what it was called. It was advertised as an M1842 smoothbore, obviously it isn't. Another party identified it as an M1835 or M1840 rework. I bought it for the Mill Creek heritage, so it's all good. The gun in question:

    - - - - - - - - -

    Note the absence of band springs, and the semi-circular nipple breech profile. Appears to possibly have been flintlock at one time. Lock markings:

    D. NIPPES
    US


    -and-

    MILL
    CREEK
    Pa
    1847
    Gloria: "65 percent of the people murdered in the last 10 years were killed by hand guns"
    Archie Bunker: "would it make you feel better, little girl, if they was pushed outta windows?"

    http://www.moviewavs.com/TV_Shows/Al...he_Family.html

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Civil War Enfield v. Springfield

    I was reading about the Gun Free School Zone Act on another thread and found out that longarms have to be in a locked case when transporting within 1000ft. of a school. I live in the burbs and there are elementary schools everywhere. Does anyone know if they make a case big enough for a 56" musket at a reasonable price? There are a couple of black powder cases at Cabela's. There is a hard case, that I think can be locked, but it is $270 and seems like it is more than I need. There is a soft case but it doesn't look like it has a double zipper so it can't be locked. Then there is an Indian print case which looks nice but can't be locked. Thanks.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Civil War Enfield v. Springfield

    Wow, this thread's a blast from the past. Solo, I'm not sure the Gun Free School Zone Act applies to original or repro antique firearms (and personally I think the entire Act is unconstitutional anyway, not that my opinion means squat), but I'm not a lawyer so I'll let that bide. I've used Morton's soft-sided cases for my muskets and long rifles for several years and have found them to be of excellent quality. Their 58-inch musket case will set you back $29.95 and includes a locking loop for the zipper, and a handy pocket on the outside for a cleaning rod. See http://www.uniquecases.com/product.php?xProd=16&xSec=7. If you have a '42 smoothbore or other longer musket, they have 62- and 66-inch cases as well, and of course they have a number of smaller cases for rifles, carbines and such. Good product, made by good folks right here in PA and over the border in WV.

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