Erie City Council is considering violating Pennsylvania's Uniform Firearms Act

[ar15jules]

This will prevent zero crime.

[JaySmith]

I gave a couple away, I still have about 7 left. They are individually packaged in cardboard and plastic.
I like building them (installing the guts). We have 4 more years, I think we'll see that deal again.

I know someone with access to a milling machine and jig. Takes about 2 hours each.

[P89]

Ghost guns are unregistered and untraceable. Erie City Council is to vote on banning them
Measure, to be considered on first reading, would ban the creation of ghost guns and prohibit their sale or transfer unless those involved have a federal firearms license.
Portrait of Ed PalattellaEd Palattella
Erie Times-News


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Erie City Council is considering an ordinance to ban the creation, sale and transfer of ghost guns, which are untraceable firearms without serial numbers.
The proposed ordinance, modeled after Philadelphia's legislation, aims to curb the use of ghost guns in crimes and promote responsible gun ownership, a councilman said.
The Pennsylvania Supreme Court is reviewing the legality of Philadelphia's ghost gun ban, and a decision could impact similar ordinances in other cities.
Erie City Council is considering an ordinance that would prohibit ghost guns — homemade firearms that lack serial numbers and are unregistered and untraceable and can be purchased without a background check. Criminal use of ghost guns has proliferated nationwide.

The ordinance is scheduled for a first reading at council's meeting at 6:30 p.m. Wednesday.

If passed on first and second readings, the measure would ban the creation of ghost guns and prohibit their sale or transfer unless those involved have a federal firearms license, which allows a business to deal, make or import firearms. Ghost guns are typically made with do-it-yourself kits using a 3D printer plus readily available metal parts.

Ghost guns seized in federal law enforcement actions are displayed at the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives field office in Glendale, California on April 18, 2022.
"This is just a way for us to support responsible gun ownership," said Erie City Councilman Chuck Nelson, who helped develop the ordinance.

Offenders would be fined $300 to $1,000, and face a prison sentence of up to 90 days if they fail to pay, according to the ordinance.

Erie Mayor Joe Schember "supports the proposed ordinance on ghost guns as a responsible attempt to keep these weapons off city streets to help protect our residents and law enforcement personnel," Schember's office said in a statement.

"City Council," according to the statement, "is trying to protect Erie residents and visitors from weapons manufactured by 3D printers. The ordinance limits public access to the material used to make 3D guns. This ordinance does not restrict or impede the ability of federally licensed gun manufacturers to legally make weapons."

Erie's ordinance would mirror Philadelphia's
Nelson said the ordinance is modeled after legislation that Philadelphia enacted in January 2021. He said Erie needs the same regulation to curb incidents related to ghost guns.

On March 11, a 22-year-old Erie man was charged in a case connected to a ghost gun. A task force with the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives found fentanyl and a ghost gun at his residence in February, according to the indictment filed in U.S. District Court in Erie.


In another Erie case, a ghost gun was connected to a killing. Erie police said a 16-year-old boy, Dazmiere Cherry, was killed in a Wayne Street residence in July 2022 when a ghost gun went off as a 13-year-old boy was handling it.

Erie police in the past year have seized about a half dozen ghost guns, Deputy Chief Rick Lorah said. Nationwide, the number of suspected ghost guns that law enforcement recovered has ballooned in recent years.

In 2016, the number was 1,758, according to the Justice Department. The department said the number was 25,785 in 2022.

Pa. Supreme Court is reviewing Philadelphia's ordinance
Ghost guns have become the focus of legislation in other Pennsylvania cities following a 4-3 Commonwealth Court ruling that upheld Philadelphia's ghost gun ban in February.

Erie would be the fourth municipality in the state to pass a ghost gun ordinance, following Philadelphia, in 2021: York, in May; and Reading, in August.

The local ordinances could be short-lived. The Commonwealth Court decision is on appeal to the state Supreme Court, which is considering whether the ban violates Pennsylvania's Uniform Firearms Act. It bars local governments from enacting gun legislation that is stricter than regulations under state law.

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In its ruling for Philadelphia's ban, a majority of Commonwealth Court — in the first case of its kind in Pennsylvania — highlighted that the ordinance "does not regulate firearms per se," but parts of firearms, such as frames, that are assembled to make ghost guns, according to the majority opinion, by Judge Ellen Ceisler.

The three Commonwealth Court judges who dissented sided with gun owners' groups who argued the ordinance violates the Uniform Firearms Act.

Erie City Councilman Chuck Nelson helped develop a proposed ordinance that would ban ghost guns in the city.
"If a local ordinance, resolution or executive order looks like a firearm regulation and walks like a firearm regulation, it is a firearm regulation and is preempted," according to a dissenting opinion by Judge Patricia McCullough.

Nelson said he and other council members are "confident in the Commonwealth Court decision and expect it to be upheld by the Supreme Court."

State, federal governments also looking at ghost guns
Statewide legislation to ban ghost guns has stalled. The Democratic-controlled house passed a prohibition in March 2024 by a vote of 104-97. The House referred the measure to the Judiciary Committee of the GOP-controlled Senate, where it has been sitting since April.

On a national level, then-President Joe Biden in 2021 announced a federal rule to require manufacturers of ghost gun kits to perform background checks and mark the weapons with serial numbers — the same requirement of standard gun producers.

The U.S. Supreme Court held arguments in October on the rule's legality. A decision could come this year.

I refuse to give that "news" outlet any money but somehow I got around the paywall.

Bogey is spot on, Nelson is just looking to get his name in the light and enough of his looney left to get on the bandwagon.

[bogey1]

I know someone with access to a milling machine and jig. Takes about 2 hours each.

These are all stripped receivers, no drilling, just add the trigger.

[chp1911]

I know someone with access to a milling machine and jig. Takes about 2 hours each.

I was under the impression that you cannot use someone else's machine tools to mill your lowers.

[P89]

I was under the impression that you cannot use someone else's machine tools to mill your lowers.

You can use others equipment as long as they aren't a business and you can't have others do the work for you. That's when you run afoul with the law.

Any person (including any corporation or other legal entity) engaged in the business of performing machining, molding, casting, forging, printing (additive manufacturing) or other manufacturing process to create a firearm frame or receiver, or to make a frame or receiver suitable for use as part of a "weapon * which will or is designed to or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive," i.e., a "firearm," must be licensed as a manufacturer under the GCA; identify (mark) any such firearm; and maintain required manufacturer*s records. A business (including an association or society) may not avoid the manufacturing license, marking, and recordkeeping requirements of the GCA by allowing persons to perform manufacturing processes on firearms (including frames or receivers) using machinery or equipment under its dominion and control where that business controls access to, and use of, such machinery or equipment. ATF Ruling 2010-10 is clarified.

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/ru...nd-gunsmithing

So since I have a Bridgeport in my garage you can use it because I'm not running a business.
Even so, you need nothing fancy to mill a blank. I've seen it done with drill press and router tables.

[JaySmith]

I was under the impression that you cannot use someone else's machine tools to mill your lowers.

From my understanding, you can use anyone's tools, but you can't use someone else to mill it out for you. Like I coudln't mill them out for you.

You can make your own firearms, but you can't make firearms for other people without being a manufacturer, which comes with extra restrictions.

[P89]

At least 3 of them are thinking.

https://www.goerie.com/story/news/lo...e/82772903007/

[cephas]

Edit: to add to P89's post :"Erie*s city council was split 3-3 in their decision, meaning that the ordinance failed to advance."
https://pennsylvania.gunowners.org/04022025/

[Carson]

Waiting to see how the PA State Supreme Court rules.