PPT to CA. FFL

**Shawn.L** · December 6th, 2008, 01:32 PM

I understand you can ship from a personal (not dealer) seller a pistol directly to an FFL out of state, as that FFL will then do the background ect to transfer the pistol to the buyer.

What is the proper way to do this ?

How do you confirm you are shipping to a real FFL ?

Is there any way for me to retain a paper trail to cover my ass as far as legality ? (cops come looking for info on this pistol, I want paperwork to prove I legally sold it)

This would be going to CA. AFAIK a used pistol, so long as it meets their mag restrictions and such, does not need to be on the approved list.

**Pa. Patriot** · December 6th, 2008, 01:37 PM

You want one of two things.

1) A copy of the FFL
2) The FFL # (or at least the first 3 and last 5)

Many FFL's will not send a FFL copy to a non-licensee (The ATF has actually recommended this)
So after you get a copy or the FFL# go to FFL Ez-Check here:
https://www.atfonline.gov/fflezcheck/

Punch in the first 3 and last 5 and the result will show you:
1) The licensed address
2) the validity of the FFL
3) Expiration date

Print this out and save with your shipping records.

Handguns must go via common carrier (no USPS) if you are non-licensee.
Regardless how you ship send it insured and restricted delivery/adult sig.

**Shawn.L** · December 6th, 2008, 01:39 PM

what is the legal method of shipping ?

**Pa. Patriot** · December 6th, 2008, 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by Shawn.L

This would be going to CA. AFAIK a used pistol, so long as it meets their mag restrictions and such, does not need to be on the approved list.

Since it is going to a FFL you do not have to worry about the legality/drop test requirements/assault weapons BS. That liability is on the FFL to not transfer to anyone not permitted by the laws of their state.

**Shawn.L** · December 6th, 2008, 01:41 PM

Originally Posted by Shawn.L

what is the legal method of shipping ?

oops..... missed it in your first reply

**Pa. Patriot** · December 6th, 2008, 01:42 PM

Originally Posted by Shawn.L

what is the legal method of shipping ?

Handguns must go common carrier (No USPS)
Fed-ex and UPS have internal policies (not law) requiring express for handguns.

When handguns are concerned it is often easier and possibly cheaper to take it to an FFL to ship for you. FFL can use USPS which with insurance and restricted delivery runs typically $20 or less. So with his fee it may still be the same or less than you shipping yourself via common carrier overnight.

**NWPA shooter** · December 6th, 2008, 07:45 PM

Not to hijack the OP thread, I do have a similar question.
This time it is involving the shipment of a 30-30 Lever action to So.Cal. (should be a legal weapon for there strange laws)
The gun is my sons,he is in the Navy. I have been told that to ship FFL to FFL
there has to be a permit for the PA dealer to ship to Cal. What if any are my other options.
Thanks

**SteveWag** · December 6th, 2008, 07:57 PM

Hold up here!!! This is a handgun going to California. No one can send a firearm into CA without pre-approval from the CA State version of the ATF. This is one reason I (and other dealers) won’t sell into CA. Check the CA state web site. I was so angry I just threw away the info and forms and said ***k buyers in CA.
Steve

**Shawn.L** · December 6th, 2008, 08:05 PM

Originally Posted by SteveWag

Hold up here!!! This is a handgun going to California. No one can send a firearm into CA without pre-approval from the CA State version of the ATF. This is one reason I (and other dealers) won’t sell into CA. Check the CA state web site. I was so angry I just threw away the info and forms and said ***k buyers in CA.
Steve

have a link to this info?

Maybe it is different for dealers, but it would seem PPT (private party transfers) are legal to CA.

http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/pubfaqs.php#5

I want to sell a gun to another person, i.e., a private party transfer. Am I required to conduct the transaction through a licensed California firearms dealer?

Yes. Firearm sales must be conducted through a fully licensed California firearms dealer. Failure to do so is a violation of California law. The buyer (and seller, in the event that the; buyer is denied), must meet the normal firearm purchase and delivery requirements. "Antique firearms," as defined in Section 921(a)(16) of Title 18 of the United States Code, and curio or relic rifles/shotguns, defined in Section 178.11 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations that are over 50 years old, are exempt from this requirement.

Firearms dealers are required to process private party transfers upon request. Firearms dealers may charge a fee not to exceed $10 per firearm for conducting a private party transfer. Example:

For a private party transfer involving one or more handguns, the total allowable fees, including the DROS, safety, and dealer transfer fees, are not to exceed $35.00 for the first handgun and $31.00 for each additional handgun involved in the same transaction.
For private party transfers involving one or more long guns, or a private party transfer involving one handgun, the total allowable fees, including the DROS, safety, and dealer transfer fees, are not to exceed $35.00. The dealer may charge an additional dealer-service fee of$10.00 per each additional firearm transferred.
(PC section 12072(d))

**Toscano** · December 6th, 2008, 11:03 PM

Originally Posted by SteveWag

Hold up here!!! This is a handgun going to California. No one can send a firearm into CA without pre-approval from the CA State version of the ATF. This is one reason I (and other dealers) won’t sell into CA. Check the CA state web site. I was so angry I just threw away the info and forms and said ***k buyers in CA.
Steve

That section there doesn't apply to PPT. Only between entities which have taken possession of them and recorded in their books. Stupid, ridiculous, YES...but that's the way it is in La la Land.