FFL called me back

[JoshIronshaft]

When the Mossberg Shockwave first came out there was a period when most FFLs were not completing the PSP handgun form for them. Then the PSP informed FFLs that they needed to complete the form on a Shockwave or similar shotgun. I missed that window of not completing the PSP form by about a week when I picked up a Shockwave. That's how I recall it anyways.

[Dlish]

for the price, I kinda want one. Why the hell not

[Jhaydeno]

What about the form that supposedly goes to the state police? To me that would be a registry.

In the court of law, when the commonwealth was sued for this supposed illegal “registry”, the courts determined that it was not a registry because it is an incomplete data set as described above (moving in/out of state, loss, sale, disposition, etc.).

[JaySmith]

for the price, I kinda want one. Why the hell not

That was my logic. I got a couple because I'm not sure about spare parts.

Just waiting on my chainsaw mount.

[Walleye Hunter]

Do they need eggs?

[TacticalSpeed]

My bet is because the state police want them to and they don*t care about the consumer, they just want to avoid hassles with the police.

+1

[gnbrotz]

What about the form that supposedly goes to the state police? To me that would be a registry.

I agree, but the courts do not, because the law does not require that every single transaction be memorialized, or that you give notice when moving guns in/out of the state.

At best, it's an imperfect one, and it's up to us to know all the LEGAL ways to keep guns off of PSP paperwork, and utilize those methods any time that we can, to help perpetuate the existing imperfections.

[bogey1]

In the court of law, when the commonwealth was sued for this supposed illegal *registry*, the courts determined that it was not a registry because it is an incomplete data set as described above (moving in/out of state, loss, sale, disposition, etc.).

I agree, but the courts do not, because the law does not require that every single transaction be memorialized, or that you give notice when moving guns in/out of the state.

At best, it's an imperfect one, and it's up to us to know all the LEGAL ways to keep guns off of PSP paperwork, and utilize those methods any time that we can, to help perpetuate the existing imperfections.

The courts can deem it what ever they want, but if they have a name and serial number, that to me sounds like a registry.

[Xringshooter]

When the Mossberg Shockwave first came out there was a period when most FFLs were not completing the PSP handgun form for them. Then the PSP informed FFLs that they needed to complete the form on a Shockwave or similar shotgun. I missed that window of not completing the PSP form by about a week when I picked up a Shockwave. That's how I recall it anyways.

I don't recall ever getting any message from the PSP concerning the paperwork requirements for these type firearms. The BATFE consider them an "Other Firearm" (Other Firearm just like a virgin AR receiver) because they were built from virgin receivers so they were not "rebuilt" from something else and all the manufacturers ran everything by the ATF before putting them on the market. I have always markd the 4473 as "OTHER" and never did a SP-113 on them and I have never been contacted by the PSP about them. I just did one 2 weeks ago and the PSP has not contacted me.

Next question, how did the PSP know it was an "Other Firearm" in the first place? Did the FFL call the PSP to ask about it maybe? Does he know you don't do that . To me it does not meet the definition on the SP-113 - it IS NOT a shotgun with a barrel of less than 18" (that definition is for a Short Barrel Shotgun which IIRC is considered a "firearm" in PA just like an SBR or a handgun. AGAIN, because of the way it was manufactured, on the 4473 it is an "OTHER" so no PSP form is needed.

If the PSP did provide "guidance" on this matter, could someone post what was distributed or contact me via PM to get me the info? Thank you, I don't need to go to jail at my age.

[esh21167]

What about the form that supposedly goes to the state police? To me that would be a registry.

That's not a registry. It's a database of buyers...

(Sarcasm intended)

I don't recall ever getting any message from the PSP concerning the paperwork requirements for these type firearms. The BATFE consider them an "AOW" (All Other Weapons just like a virgin AR receiver) because they were built from virgin receivers so they were not "rebuilt" from something else and all the manufacturers ran everything by the ATF before putting them on the market. I have always markd the 4473 as "OTHER" and never did a SP-113 on them and I have never been contacted by the PSP about them. I just did one 2 weeks ago and the PSP has not contacted me.

Next question, how did the PSP know it was a AOW in the first place? Did the FFL call the PSP to ask about it maybe? Does he know you don't do that . To me it does not meet the definition on the SP-113 - it IS NOT a shotgun with a barrel of less than 18" (that definition is for a Short Barrel Shotgun which IIRC is considered a "firearm" in PA just like an SBR or a handgun. AGAIN, because of the way it was manufactured, on the 4473 it is an "OTHER" so no PSP form is needed.

If the PSP did provide "guidance" on this matter, could someone post what was distributed or contact me via PM to get me the info? Thank you, I don't need to go to jail at my age.

Is AOW the actual BATFE term? Isn't that Any Other Weapon, which IS NFA?