Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
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    East side of the ANF, Pennsylvania
    (Elk County)
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    Default Re: Did the law change?

    Quote Originally Posted by pens87pgh View Post
    This is a way for the ATF to get us to stop complaining about the NFA. "Oh we can get our stuff sent directly to our house...after going through all of the hoops to buy a piece of metal? Awesome!"

    It's a distraction. Repeal the NFA and abolish the ATF.

    Repealing the NFA won't happen. You never hear the ATF or even Congress critters talk about permabanning NFA weapons or suppressors, because the NFA transfers are a cash cow for the ATF. It's many millions of $$$ every year.

    You don't write checks or MOs for the transfer taxes to "United States Treasury" like is done when you owe tax to the IRS. The payee is "BATFE". Now, BATFE says they deposit the transfer tax $$$ in the Treasury; a data table on their website for 2020 states that transfer taxes go to the general fund of the US Treasury. What we don't know is if those $$$ are "credited" to the BATFE budget.

    For 2020:

    NFA registration applications (and transfer applications) 487,745
    NFA registrations processed (total weapons) 512,315 forms (2,353,436 weapons)
    NFA making and transfer tax collected $51,700,000

    That bears repeating:

    $51,700,000
    in NFA transfer taxes collected in 2020.

    (source: https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/...scal-year-2020)

    Fact is, .gov gets $$$$$$$$, and they ain't gonna let that go. It's the sole reason that the "Hearing Protection Act" to remove suppressors from NFA failed to make it through Congress a few years back. BATFE testified in committee that removing suppressors from NFA would "break their rice bowl" and additional appropriations would be needed to make up the loss to BATFE.

    What's that saying? Oh, yeah . . . Follow the $$$.

    Noah
    Last edited by Noah_Zark; February 24th, 2022 at 11:03 AM.
    Wisdom and knowledge shall be the stability of thy times.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    State College, Pennsylvania
    (Centre County)
    Age
    71
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    Default Re: Did the law change?

    Quote Originally Posted by buckengr View Post
    This article by Prince law talks about this situation in more detail. https://blog.princelaw.com/2016/11/3...ough-the-mail/

    I knew that FFLs could mail suppressors once approved, but didn't realize they have to submit an additional copy of 4473 to the CLEO before they can ship it.
    Ok, sorta makes sense to me, FFL does the 4473, sends a copy to the CLEO by certified mail or return receipt to prove the FFL did what he was supposed to, file the origional with the NFA paperwork the FFL keeps, mails the suppressor and everything is fine.

    Now I know this will not go over very well, but I've had numerous customers saying they would have no problem paying the tax if all the checks and wait times were dropped. Go into a FFL/SOT, purchase your NFA item (not just supprressors but all NFA items), do the standard background check by NICS, pay the tax and walk out with the item. The ATF could then be utilized better to investigate/prosecute illegal alcohol, tabacco, firearms and explosives matters.
    Last edited by Xringshooter; February 24th, 2022 at 04:30 PM.
    Ron USAF Ret E-8 FFL01/SOT3 NRA Benefactor Member

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    East side of the ANF, Pennsylvania
    (Elk County)
    Posts
    7,018
    Rep Power
    21474859

    Default Re: Did the law change?

    Quote Originally Posted by Xringshooter View Post
    Ok, sorta makes sense to me, FFL does the 4473, sends a copy to the CLEO by certified mail or return receipt to prove the FFL did what he was supposed to, file the origional with the NFA paperwork the FFL keeps, mails the suppressor and everything is fine.

    Now I know this will not go over very well, but I've had numerous customers saying they would have no problem paying the tax if all the checks and wait times were dropped. Go into a FFL/SOT, purchase your NFA item (not just supprressors but all NFA items), do the standard background check by NICS, pay the tax and walk out with the item. The ATF could then be utilized better to investigate/prosecute illegal alcohol, tabacco, firearms and explosives matters.
    Could not agree more, but the part in bold above would require more field agents and the people who process the NFA transfers work out of the ATF facility on Needy Rd in Martinsburg, WV, across from the VA hospital there. They are office/clerical/button and pencil pusher types who look up records and match them. Freeing them up would not result in more investigations or prosecutions; it would result in loss of jobs in that Congressional district, and we can't have that happen, can we?

    I am reminded of the drop in NFA processing times that took place in 2006-2008 when the NFA Branch in Martinsburg got a new manager who shook things up and set performance quotas for those that processed NFA transfers. The last NFA item I made at the time was processed in six (6) weeks. That's WEEKS. There was a surge in NFA item sales and transfers because the economy was booming anyway, pre "Great Recession", but lots of people bought/made NFA items because the transfer time had dropped from 9-12 months to 6-8 weeks. BUT, the clerical types were processing like 5X and more the applications per day that they had been, and they did not like it. Complaints flew into ATF HQ in DC, and that manager who boosted efficiency was relocated. Productivity went back to what it had been, 9-12 months. The clerical types set their own productivity goals, and those of us who are NFA item fans suffer for the bureaucracy.

    Noah
    Wisdom and knowledge shall be the stability of thy times.

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