Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #21
    Join Date
    May 2009
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    Glenmoore, Pennsylvania
    (Chester County)
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    Default Re: Need help understanding "Great Bodily Injury", et. al.

    Quote Originally Posted by JoshIronshaft View Post
    So, hindsight debate aside, the real question you have is a good one.

    How do I know the exact moment I can use lethal force to defend myself?

    I don't think this question has a simple answer.
    Certainly not simple.

    However, Castle Doctrine notwithstanding - for me, I would have to be, 1) cornered/boxed-in, 2) with no means to evade and, 3) in fear for my life.

    I believe that these three key factors would give me an opportunity for no charges to be filed against me or to have a chance in court.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    May 2010
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    Scenery Hill, Pennsylvania
    (Washington County)
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    Default Re: Need help understanding "Great Bodily Injury", et. al.

    Quote Originally Posted by JAKIII View Post
    Certainly not simple.

    However, Castle Doctrine notwithstanding - for me, I would have to be, 1) cornered/boxed-in, 2) with no means to evade and, 3) in fear for my life.

    I believe that these three key factors would give me an opportunity for no charges to be filed against me or to have a chance in court.
    Your 3 points are parallel to the 4 points I linked to. If you can check those 4 boxes and stars align then you should come out on the other side of the legal system ok.
    In America arms are free merchandise such that anyone who has the capital may make their houses into armories and their gardens into parks of artillery. - Ira Allen, 1796

  3. #23
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    Jan 2013
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    (Juniata County)
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    Default Re: Need help understanding "Great Bodily Injury", et. al.

    You do not have a duty to retreat.

    But legally, you*re in a stronger position if you*re in your car/home.

    That said, it is easy to *think* someone is following you when they are not. I*m sure we*ve all had that happen.
    "Cives Arma Ferant"

    "I know I'm not James Bond, that's why I don't keep a loaded gun under the pillow, or bang Russian spies on a regular basis." - GunLawyer001

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
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    Bucks, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: Need help understanding "Great Bodily Injury", et. al.

    Sometimes you still have to retreat, if you can. Sometimes, it's hard or impossible to claim self-defense. Many factors are involved. Are you doing anything illegal? Is the attacker an undercover LEO? Did you provoke the attacker?

    Safest bet is to follow my simple rule: If you shoot the perp, and end up in prison for 10 years as a result, in Year 9 will you be staring up at Bubba's back and thinking "I'd shoot again", or will you be thinking "I should have just run away"?

    I wouldn't shoot to stop a bank robber who's running away. I would shoot to stop someone from raping someone I cared about, even if I did time because I got a bad jury and a Kenosha-style prosecutor.

    Between the extremes is a judgment call. And no safe harbor. Failing to shoot can get you or another innocent killed. Shooting can put you in prison. Look at Kyle Rittenhouse and see that even the most absurdly obvious case of self-defense can result in an expensive trial and a real risk of conviction, especially where the prosecutors are willing to fabricate evidence.
    Attorney Phil Kline, AKA gunlawyer001@gmail.com
    Ce sac n'est pas un jouet.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Levittown, Pennsylvania
    (Bucks County)
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    Default Re: Need help understanding "Great Bodily Injury", et. al.

    Friend who carries said if someone robbed him at gunpoint on a parking lot (for example) he would just give him the money and would not shoot him to avoid all that could follow.

    Good call, if it works out. BUT...how often have we read where the robber shoots and kills the cooperative victim ANYWAY. Is it a good idea to risk being shot and killed by someone who might be a two-time loser and you are the only witness to his possibly third loss?

    Hey! Y'know....the Soros prosecutors who want to reduce sentences just might be saving lives!
    There are two kinds of guns. Those I have acquired, and those I hope to.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Jeannette, Pennsylvania
    (Westmoreland County)
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    Default Re: Need help understanding "Great Bodily Injury", et. al.

    Quote Originally Posted by GunLawyer001 View Post
    I wouldn't even leave my car parked unguarded in the lot, after the guy followed you across the lot.

    Plenty of Walmarts, go to another one, especially if you have the kids along. Drive to the police station, he'll give up following you.
    100% agreed. If you know you are being followed just drive to the nearest police department. They have cameras everywhere. I've had to use this once and when I pulled up to the PD the person following me bugged out quick, fast and in a hurry.

    You didn't do anything wrong besides sticking around to find out what the mans intent was. There is nothing at Walmart important enough for me to risk my kids life over. Had the man pulled a gun on you and you ended up in a gunfight you would have literally put your kids in the crossfire.

    Castle Doctrine says you have the right to defend yourself wherever you have the legal right to be. You have no duty to retreat. Hopefully the aggressor learned a very valuable lesson and curbs his emotions going forward before he gives my trauma surgeon friend or funeral director wife some business.
    Home brewing; because Jeeps and ammunition aren't cheap. WILL WORK FOR AMMO & FIREARMS!

  7. #27
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Glenmoore, Pennsylvania
    (Chester County)
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    65
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    Default Re: Need help understanding "Great Bodily Injury", et. al.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrBear13 View Post
    Hopefully the aggressor learned a very valuable lesson and curbs his emotions going forward before he gives my trauma surgeon friend or funeral director wife some business.
    Road ragers are a whole different level of crazy. They are unstable and unable to control their anger. The road is an extension of their home where they are *in-charge* and beat their wives, kids and the dog when they make mistakes.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
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    Jeannette, Pennsylvania
    (Westmoreland County)
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    Default Re: Need help understanding "Great Bodily Injury", et. al.

    Quote Originally Posted by JAKIII View Post
    Road ragers are a whole different level of crazy. They are unstable and unable to control their anger. The road is an extension of their home where they are *in-charge* and beat their wives, kids and the dog when they make mistakes.
    I'm aware, I'm just saying that there is a chance that the man could have a "come to Jesus" moment before he has a "get sent to Jesus" moment. I realize that he has a higher chance of dying from the coof than he does having a come to Jesus moment but a chance is a chance.
    Home brewing; because Jeeps and ammunition aren't cheap. WILL WORK FOR AMMO & FIREARMS!

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    philadelphia, Pennsylvania
    (Montgomery County)
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    Default Re: Need help understanding "Great Bodily Injury", et. al.

    Quote Originally Posted by lager1829 View Post
    Read The Law of Self Defense Principals book by Attorney Andrew Branca. It's free from his website, you pay shipping.
    My order took a couple of weeks, but it just shipped! Thanks.

    Thank you for your order from Law of Self Defense! We wanted to let you know that your order (#1034998) was shipped via USPS, USPS Media Mail on 2/16/2022. You can track your package at any time using the link below.
    Quote Originally Posted by larger1829 View Post
    Some on here ordered it and complained about getting spammed.
    I set up a special email address just for the order-- they definitely send a ton of mail -- but it was easy to get off his lists. Throw away email addressess make life better.

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