JSDsupply owner buys Eagle Shows

[mauser]

Lebanon had good shows several years ago, but then a different promoter took over and nearly killed the shows for us, they didn't advertise and "promote" effectively. A different promoter took over and ran our shows even further into the ground. Finally Eagle Arms started promoting and things turned around quickly. All vendor spots were filled and the crowd was shoulder to shoulder, it was almost too much. We've had a few years of good shows while being promoted by Eagle Arms. The show we had this past weekend was OK, but not as good as previous shows. The October show was a real disappointment though, That must have been the last one promoted by Eagle Arms. I was told the reason for poor turnout of vendors and shoppers was because the Harrisburg show was the same weekend. I hope this "new" promoter doesn't let us down like the few who tried before Eagle Arms stepped in and rescued us.

[Tripper]

That explains why the Eagle Arms shows have been going downhill in the past two years. I used to travel their Gettysburg, Lebanon and Bloomsburg shows but not now. They all have been getting smaller and smaller so its not worth the bother.

[cellboothmgr]

That explains why the Eagle Arms shows have been going downhill in the past two years. I used to travel their Gettysburg, Lebanon and Bloomsburg shows but not now. They all have been getting smaller and smaller so its not worth the bother.

We've actually set both attendance and vendor participation records since we've taken over at nearly every venue. A lot of the down turn you're seeing is from the massive flood of panic buying for the last 2-3 years. The market has cooled off for several reasons. We are constantly adding different methods of advertising. If you have a suggestion we'd love to take a look at it.

[mauser]

We've actually set both attendance and vendor participation records since we've taken over at nearly every venue. A lot of the down turn you're seeing is from the massive flood of panic buying for the last 2-3 years. The market has cooled off for several reasons. We are constantly adding different methods of advertising. If you have a suggestion we'd love to take a look at it.

If I could suggest one thing it would be stop raising the price of admission. Someone asked me about a particular brand of .22LR ammo, (I think it was PMC), that he happened to get a box of some time ago and finally tried it and really liked it, but can't find it anywhere. I suggested the Lebanon gun show on June 3, & 4,. He balked at the idea saying he can go into any gun shop or sporting goods store and look around for free, he's not thrilled with paying almost $10.00 just to walk in and not know if he'll find what he's looking for or not. There is a wide variety at the gun shows, more than you'll find at any single gun shop that I know of, but you don't have to pay to enter a gun shop. Money is tight these days and the $9.00 admission fee could be the difference between buying two or three boxes of .22LR, or the difference between buying something and nothing at all. If someone wants something specific that should cost about $50.00 and he has an allotted budget of $50.00 he's not going to want to spend 18% of his budget just to walk into the building. Inflation is hurting a lot of people lately . Everyone NEEDS food and fuel, but a box of .22 ammo is a lot less likely to be considered a need, it's a want. If a budget needs to be trimmed a little bit the admission price of a gun show is an easy cost to eliminate because on top of saving the $9.00 admission there's also no chance to spend money on an impulse buy once inside.
The free parking is a plus, but the price increasing by $1.00 every time the show comes to town may keep people away.
I couldn't make it to this latest show so I didn't have a chance to talk to any vendors, but at previous shows there were opinions stating that customer flow was down so profits were down meaning that some of the vendors may feel it's not worth the work and the vendor fees to sit there all day and watch people walk past with their hands in their pockets.

[Ronin]

If I could suggest one thing it would be stop raising the price of admission. Someone asked me about a particular brand of .22LR ammo, (I think it was PMC), that he happened to get a box of some time ago and finally tried it and really liked it, but can't find it anywhere. I suggested the Lebanon gun show on June 3, & 4,. He balked at the idea saying he can go into any gun shop or sporting goods store and look around for free, he's not thrilled with paying almost $10.00 just to walk in and not know if he'll find what he's looking for or not. There is a wide variety at the gun shows, more than you'll find at any single gun shop that I know of, but you don't have to pay to enter a gun shop. Money is tight these days and the $9.00 admission fee could be the difference between buying two or three boxes of .22LR, or the difference between buying something and nothing at all. If someone wants something specific that should cost about $50.00 and he has an allotted budget of $50.00 he's not going to want to spend 18% of his budget just to walk into the building. Inflation is hurting a lot of people lately . Everyone NEEDS food and fuel, but a box of .22 ammo is a lot less likely to be considered a need, it's a want. If a budget needs to be trimmed a little bit the admission price of a gun show is an easy cost to eliminate because on top of saving the $9.00 admission there's also no chance to spend money on an impulse buy once inside.
The free parking is a plus, but the price increasing by $1.00 every time the show comes to town may keep people away.
I couldn't make it to this latest show so I didn't have a chance to talk to any vendors, but at previous shows there were opinions stating that customer flow was down so profits were down meaning that some of the vendors may feel it's not worth the work and the vendor fees to sit there all day and watch people walk past with their hands in their pockets.

That's the chance you take whenever you go to a gun show. The last gun show I went to that didn't charge admission was over 30 years ago. If you can't afford $10 for admission, then you have more pressing financial issues, and probably have no business buying ammo.

[Walleye Hunter]

That's the chance you take whenever you go to a gun show. The last gun show I went to that didn't charge admission was over 30 years ago. If you can't afford $10 for admission, then you have more pressing financial issues, and probably have no business buying ammo.

Economics 101: If one is looking for one particular item, which is available at a gun show for $10 less than the LGS, then paying $10+for entrance fees totally negates the savings.

[JoshIronshaft]

I don't like increasing admission prices, but I would rather pay an extra dollar admission than experience a decrease in vendors because the cost of vendor tables is going up to bare all of the rising costs, and I'm sure costs are going up.

[Marines55]

I don't like increasing admission prices, but I would rather pay an extra dollar admission than experience a decrease in vendors because the cost of vendor tables is going up to bare all of the rising costs, and I'm sure costs are going up.

People paying an extra dollar to get in doesn*t help the vendors*.it only makes the promoter richer. The problem is over saturation of shows, rising costs, and so much more. We literally just spoke with several out of state customers today that asked us why we were not at Oaks. We told them that honestly, the numbers just cannot support doing the show as the median price of a sold firearm dropped from $2000 to $300 over the last several shows. The costs of doing the show have increased 120%, sales are down 50%, and profit margins are down 85% at that show. They all replied that they used to go to Oaks every show but have not gone and will not go for the foreseeable future as the shows are lacking ( exact words were the shows at oaks haven*t been good for the last year ).

While reported attendance records are being set, the dealers surely aren*t seeing the effect of that simply because of economics 101. Since the show is being held 6-7 weeks apart, the average show goer that used to have $600 to spend at each show, now only has $150 to spend. Take away some of that for the show entrance, and he is left with just over $100. That wont buy a firearm, so he spends it on socks, Chinese knives, a barbed wire baseball bat, and whatever else cheap fun he can get for the weekend. Without the discriminating collectors showing up to spend money on higher ticket items, there is very little to no profit in it for actual firearm dealers. The problem, unfortunately is far more than just a higher admission fee. The people who do collect firearms are now finding it more productive and cheaper to sit in their underpants and surf gunbroker. I can*t blame them*.its just simple economics and signs of the times.

I hope the shows can be revived but its been our experience over the last 30+ years that when a show falls on hard times, the first loss is dealers*which in turn leads to loss of customers and creates the violent cycle that several shows mentioned in these posts are already seeing. Reviving those shows*.well thats something that has yet to happen as we can all reference many shows that used to be great and are now a mere shadow of themselves. Sure, bigger crowds are good for the guy taking door admission, but they surely don*t mean increased sales to gun dealers. Those numbers are not congruent and certainly cannot be used in an argument about how well the show is doing. When Oaks actually starts drawing in people from New York, Virginia, West Virginia, Ohio, etc. again..thats when we will all see the big change. Until that point the smaller dealers simply will start dropping out and the show will only be attended by dealers from out of state, large retail shops, etc. while that may sound like a plus to some, it is certainly a detriment to all for many reasons. I used to enjoy going to shows both as a buyer and a seller but over the last 2 years*it hasn*t been much fun at all. Gunbroker seems to net us the best ROI. Our last show there we sold 15 guns and broke even. We literally gave away 15 guns to pay a bill. We sold 3 guns on gunbroker last week and made more than we did at the last 4 Oaks shows combined. Our results may not be the same as every other dealer, but i can assure you that they are the same for many other dealers.

I don*t want this post to sounds like im digging at the promoter or anything or anyone else. The promoter needs to make money and put food on the table just like the dealers do. But, i can certainly reinforce all of the concerns that are being echoed on these posts as we hear the same feedback from many many many other people who come in the shop. Like i said, I don*t have the answer. Even if i did, im not sure it would work and things would be better in 3 months. The damage is done and unfortunately it will probably take months or years to get it back on track.

[carrguy1]

I*m not going to bother multi-quoting everything recently posted that I agree with but I*ll echo the entrance prices. Yes, everyone*s expenses have been up for the last couple of years so, yes, everyone needs to raise their prices so, yes, everyone just keeps getting squeezed. This show always used to be a must attend for me. Even if I didn*t buy anything I liked to walk around and look. Then my young son started coming with me and it was a nice thing for us to bond over. I*m into Milsurps. He*s into militaria. He was free and it used to cost me $9-10 to get in. Not bad for a father and young son to spend a day bonding and talking. Then it was $11 for a while. The entrance prices seem to have risen quite sharply over these recent years and before you say a dollar here or there extra is still cheap, it*s that dollar or two every couple of months that keeps increasing that becomes very annoying. Consumer sentiment is a real thing that can*t just be shrugged off. The increases almost every time I went, combined with him no longer being free means that it very quickly became more expensive than I*d want to pay just to walk around every time a show comes up.

I*ve missed the last few mostly because of being busy but the annoyance at the entrance cost definitely plays a factor. It seemed to go from $11 to $12 to $13 within a few shows. I*m a milsurp collector. I have an idea what things are worth and what I*ve been able to get them for elsewhere. When I have gone and paid the entrance and see stuff that*s either significantly more than it should be or in much worse condition than I can find for the same price, walking around isn*t fun anymore. I*m pretty sure the last time I went it was $13 for just me and he was free. I just checked the site and it*s now $15. Now that I*m paying for two that means our outing went from $10-11 not that long ago to $30 with a fair chance I*m not going to buy anything once inside. So, in my situation, it*s not just a dollar or two more. It’s suddenly about $17 more. I*m sure I*ll go back to this show here and there but not every time, not for $30 now.

I joined the Forks of the Delaware Historical Arms Society and, while it*s a different and smaller show, for $25/yr I can go to every one of their shows with my son for free and with early admission.

[Ronin]

Economics 101: If one is looking for one particular item, which is available at a gun show for $10 less than the LGS, then paying $10+for entrance fees totally negates the savings.

If you're going to a gun show to look for one thing AND hoping to save money, then you're probably doing it wrong.


No, you're definitely doing it wrong.