Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #31
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    Default Re: Pittsburgh Gun Show February 6 - 7, 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by Emptymag View Post
    What?
    How does a "woman" shop?

    Like this?

    Does this gun go with my shoes???
    Surely you jest!

    They look at EVERYTHING on the rack...on EVERY rack. I don't see too many guys at a gun show (or anywhere else) who do that. So doing so would arouse my suspicions.
    If you're afraid of the people you represent, you might be doing something wrong

  2. #32
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    Default Re: Pittsburgh Gun Show February 6 - 7, 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by scruff View Post
    That's a whole lot of conjecture. It takes more than handing a friend some money to get arrested for a straw purchase. The gun needs to be illegally transferred.

    Is it really so bad that they're enforcing the straw purchase law? I see that as a good thing.
    Good thing? It depends on how you see it, profiling black women because they may be breaking the law, doesn't affect most of us gun owners, because we aren't black women.

    How about when the ATF and DOJ decide that its white supremacists males, that are the problem, and we again go under the profile of "He who needs watching" again?

    Because there are lots of people in Washington right now deciding that Republicans, Conservatives, and GASP, even us Libertarians, are all the bad people who tried to overthrow the election after the "Ahem" insurrection at the capital, and now its US, that are the ones who are to blame for all the ills of this nation.

    We have seen that you can destroy cities, injure cops, and if you are on the correct side, you are just peaceful protesters, and not one damn person gets prosecuted.

    But I damn well guarantee you, a whole bunch of people who thought they could walk into the congressional building, OUR building, not THEIRS, wouldn't be a problem, and I bet you are going to see more people jailed, than from the entire summer of rioting, destruction or worse.

    So, if the solution to stopping illegal guns is to watch thousands of innocent people to produce arrests in the small quantity they did, why not focus the efforts where the crimes ACTUALLY OCCUR, in the hood, you know, Homewood, the North Side, and the Monroeville Mall, seems to be more crime there, especially shootings, than at the gun show.

    These bums are easy pickings, and easy arrests, going to the war zones and getting actual hardcore criminals is what's needed, and, lets be clear, nobody wants to do that, and frankly, nobody really cares.

    What concerns me, is that eventually that system, will be abused for the rest of us, and just not a couple hood rats. Just wait until background checks are mandatory for any gun transaction, and you will see the abuse the system brings.

  3. #33
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    Default Re: Pittsburgh Gun Show February 6 - 7, 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by frick View Post
    Good thing? It depends on how you see it, profiling black women because they may be breaking the law, doesn't affect most of us gun owners, because we aren't black women.

    How about when the ATF and DOJ decide that its white supremacists males, that are the problem, and we again go under the profile of "He who needs watching" again?

    Because there are lots of people in Washington right now deciding that Republicans, Conservatives, and GASP, even us Libertarians, are all the bad people who tried to overthrow the election after the "Ahem" insurrection at the capital, and now its US, that are the ones who are to blame for all the ills of this nation.

    We have seen that you can destroy cities, injure cops, and if you are on the correct side, you are just peaceful protesters, and not one damn person gets prosecuted.

    But I damn well guarantee you, a whole bunch of people who thought they could walk into the congressional building, OUR building, not THEIRS, wouldn't be a problem, and I bet you are going to see more people jailed, than from the entire summer of rioting, destruction or worse.

    So, if the solution to stopping illegal guns is to watch thousands of innocent people to produce arrests in the small quantity they did, why not focus the efforts where the crimes ACTUALLY OCCUR, in the hood, you know, Homewood, the North Side, and the Monroeville Mall, seems to be more crime there, especially shootings, than at the gun show.

    These bums are easy pickings, and easy arrests, going to the war zones and getting actual hardcore criminals is what's needed, and, lets be clear, nobody wants to do that, and frankly, nobody really cares.

    What concerns me, is that eventually that system, will be abused for the rest of us, and just not a couple hood rats. Just wait until background checks are mandatory for any gun transaction, and you will see the abuse the system brings.
    Let's stick with facts in evidence, not wild conjecture. There's no evidence of profiling. Gun owners often say "What good are more gun laws when you don't enforce the laws we already have?" We don't get to say that and then whine about them actually enforcing existing laws. I have no problem with a task force that arrests straw purchasers who give guns to criminals, and leaves the rest of us alone. Yes, that's a good thing.

  4. #34
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    Default Re: Pittsburgh Gun Show February 6 - 7, 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by frick View Post
    Good thing? It depends on how you see it, profiling black women because they may be breaking the law, doesn't affect most of us gun owners, because we aren't black women.

    How about when the ATF and DOJ decide that its white supremacists males, that are the problem, and we again go under the profile of "He who needs watching" again?

    Because there are lots of people in Washington right now deciding that Republicans, Conservatives, and GASP, even us Libertarians, are all the bad people who tried to overthrow the election after the "Ahem" insurrection at the capital, and now its US, that are the ones who are to blame for all the ills of this nation.

    We have seen that you can destroy cities, injure cops, and if you are on the correct side, you are just peaceful protesters, and not one damn person gets prosecuted.

    But I damn well guarantee you, a whole bunch of people who thought they could walk into the congressional building, OUR building, not THEIRS, wouldn't be a problem, and I bet you are going to see more people jailed, than from the entire summer of rioting, destruction or worse.

    So, if the solution to stopping illegal guns is to watch thousands of innocent people to produce arrests in the small quantity they did, why not focus the efforts where the crimes ACTUALLY OCCUR, in the hood, you know, Homewood, the North Side, and the Monroeville Mall, seems to be more crime there, especially shootings, than at the gun show.

    These bums are easy pickings, and easy arrests, going to the war zones and getting actual hardcore criminals is what's needed, and, lets be clear, nobody wants to do that, and frankly, nobody really cares.

    What concerns me, is that eventually that system, will be abused for the rest of us, and just not a couple hood rats. Just wait until background checks are mandatory for any gun transaction, and you will see the abuse the system brings.
    That's quite a rant there. Maybe you aren't aware but we are all under constant watch and scrutiny of the law man. They sit on the side of the road looking for speeders and they must observe hundreds of us before they see one who needs correction. A couple with two kids who are dressed well probably don't even get noticed by security when they walk into Macy's but a couple of teenage hoodrats hanging around the electronics department will get some screen time. I'm only in a gun show for maybe two hours and I see what look like straw purchases and there must be 12 hours or more of business conducted besides those two hours. You're suggesting that the transgressions should be ignored? I'm not saying that the crimes on the streets shouldn't be addressed, they should be and more strongly enforced than they are. In case you haven't taken notice there is a war on against our 2A rights and we are all ambassadors who are under scrutiny and if we don't do our part, we are going to lose our rights over those who abuse them.
    If you're afraid of the people you represent, you might be doing something wrong

  5. #35
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    Default Re: Pittsburgh Gun Show February 6 - 7, 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by scruff View Post
    Let's stick with facts in evidence, not wild conjecture. There's no evidence of profiling. Gun owners often say "What good are more gun laws when you don't enforce the laws we already have?" We don't get to say that and then whine about them actually enforcing existing laws. I have no problem with a task force that arrests straw purchasers who give guns to criminals, and leaves the rest of us alone. Yes, that's a good thing.
    Not conjecture, in the publicized article a few years ago, all the people detained were only black women, that was the point of the article, they were denied counsel, they were detained for hours with no specific charges ever being filed, and it was a basically an attempt to get them to admit to doing something illegal, they didn't have specific evidence they had did anything wrong, they were sweating out confessions.

    And, before you embrace the straw man laws, you should perhaps understand them, and how they have been abused.

    In one case, an LEO, ordered a Glock from a gun dealer, to obtain their LE discount, the pistol he was buying was for an uncle, he paid for it, he purchased it, the pistol was sent to another FFL, where the uncle went and had the pistol legally transferred into his name, afterwards, in the claim that the LEO was a bad cop, he was then prosecuted and convicted for committing a straw man purchase, now, everything was legal, except for the fact, that he was not purchasing the pistol for himself.

    His intent seemed legal, buy a gun, legally gift it, except, that violates federal law, even though you are free to buy a gun, and then give it away, you CANNOT, buy the gun KNOWING, its going to be for someone else, same actions are perfectly legal, except for INTENT.

    When I was younger, I went into a gun shop, too far away to conveniently return to while we were at a job, I had forgotten my drivers license, and, another guy I was working with used his, to get the rifle, the dealer KNEW, I didn't have my ID, and he had no problem letting my coworker buy the gun, this was before the straw man laws, now, there was no INTENT to do a straw man purchase, the sale was legal, THEN, that same situation today, would be prohibited, even if there was NO INTENT to break the law.

    A key legal point, is INTENT, that's why drunken drivers don't get the same jail time for murdering someone that a person who INTENTIONALLY crosses the center line and heads on someone does, as we had happen, when the driver intended to kill himself and his spouse locally, he faced murder charges after surviving the wreck.

    Straw man laws can get you convicted with no intent to commit a crime, except on paper, and that's why I tend to not support any law that can make an innocent person guilty on a legal technicality, IF, a prosecutor wants to make a case.

    In other words, look at the lawyer and his wife in St. Louis, who are facing charges, while defending their home and persons, from illegally gathered trespassers, with no real legal case, the prosecutor is abusing the law, remember, a law you MAY support, to go after some white folks, on a completely political vendetta.

    Be careful what you wish for, because it may be used against you.

  6. #36
    Join Date
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    Default Re: Pittsburgh Gun Show February 6 - 7, 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by frick View Post
    Not conjecture, in the publicized article a few years ago, all the people detained were only black women, that was the point of the article, they were denied counsel, they were detained for hours with no specific charges ever being filed, and it was a basically an attempt to get them to admit to doing something illegal, they didn't have specific evidence they had did anything wrong, they were sweating out confessions.

    And, before you embrace the straw man laws, you should perhaps understand them, and how they have been abused.

    In one case, an LEO, ordered a Glock from a gun dealer, to obtain their LE discount, the pistol he was buying was for an uncle, he paid for it, he purchased it, the pistol was sent to another FFL, where the uncle went and had the pistol legally transferred into his name, afterwards, in the claim that the LEO was a bad cop, he was then prosecuted and convicted for committing a straw man purchase, now, everything was legal, except for the fact, that he was not purchasing the pistol for himself.

    His intent seemed legal, buy a gun, legally gift it, except, that violates federal law, even though you are free to buy a gun, and then give it away, you CANNOT, buy the gun KNOWING, its going to be for someone else, same actions are perfectly legal, except for INTENT.

    When I was younger, I went into a gun shop, too far away to conveniently return to while we were at a job, I had forgotten my drivers license, and, another guy I was working with used his, to get the rifle, the dealer KNEW, I didn't have my ID, and he had no problem letting my coworker buy the gun, this was before the straw man laws, now, there was no INTENT to do a straw man purchase, the sale was legal, THEN, that same situation today, would be prohibited, even if there was NO INTENT to break the law.

    A key legal point, is INTENT, that's why drunken drivers don't get the same jail time for murdering someone that a person who INTENTIONALLY crosses the center line and heads on someone does, as we had happen, when the driver intended to kill himself and his spouse locally, he faced murder charges after surviving the wreck.

    Straw man laws can get you convicted with no intent to commit a crime, except on paper, and that's why I tend to not support any law that can make an innocent person guilty on a legal technicality, IF, a prosecutor wants to make a case.

    In other words, look at the lawyer and his wife in St. Louis, who are facing charges, while defending their home and persons, from illegally gathered trespassers, with no real legal case, the prosecutor is abusing the law, remember, a law you MAY support, to go after some white folks, on a completely political vendetta.

    Be careful what you wish for, because it may be used against you.
    Here's a very simple question - do you support women making straw purchases for criminals?

  7. #37
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    Default Re: Pittsburgh Gun Show February 6 - 7, 2021

    Quote Originally Posted by scruff View Post
    Here's a very simple question - do you support women making straw purchases for criminals?
    No, of course not, do you support jailing someone because they bought a gun for their uncle?

    Do you support LE profiling white guys with Hawaii style shirts? Or a Trump shirt?

    Because that is EXACTLY who is being blamed for an insurrection against our illegally elected government.

    Edit to ad this: I do know convicted felons, who some want to restore their right to vote, why then, is not the right to own a firearm also in need of being restored to them all?

    At what point, does your punishment end? A year later, ten? Ever?

    I'll admit this, if the time comes, that I need to hand a convicted felon a gun, because of some event, that requires our mutual need to defend ourselves, I know a few that I wouldn't hesitate to give a gun to.

    People make mistakes, sometimes very good people, and, someone who was an addict, and lost their right to own a gun say for DUI convictions, and has been clean and sober for 25 years, in my opinion, is reformed enough to own a firearm.

    Making the blanket statement that no convicted felon should ever own a gun again, is not something I'm willing to say, or support.

  8. #38
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    Default Re: Pittsburgh Gun Show February 6 - 7, 2021

    Bruh. All I've said was that I'm glad criminals were arrested, that people buying guns for criminals SHOULD be arrested, I'm glad they didn't harass lawful gun owners at the show, and that I haven't seen any evidence of profiling. Nothing very controversial there.

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