Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #31
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    Default Re: PICS background check denial confusion with M2

    Quote Originally Posted by GunLawyer001 View Post
    To be fair, the sheriff has to tell you why you're being denied an LTCF, but PICS doesn't. And few folks are criminally prosecuted for failing a PICS check through the sheriff's office.

    The 4473 gets you prosecuted, there's no 4473 for an LTCF. And a Challenge Form gets you prosecuted, you don't need one of those if the sheriff is denying you himself, only when he runs PICS and you are denied, at which point the sheriff is unable to override PICS and issue the LTCF.
    Aaaa ok, I figured they'd treat each the same though I should know better.
    Thank you for keeping me safe.

  2. #32
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    Brookville, Pennsylvania
    (Jefferson County)
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    Default Re: PICS background check denial confusion with M2

    Quote Originally Posted by GunLawyer001 View Post
    To be fair, the sheriff has to tell you why you're being denied an LTCF, but PICS doesn't. And few folks are criminally prosecuted for failing a PICS check through the sheriff's office.

    The 4473 gets you prosecuted, there's no 4473 for an LTCF. And a Challenge Form gets you prosecuted, you don't need one of those if the sheriff is denying you himself, only when he runs PICS and you are denied, at which point the sheriff is unable to override PICS and issue the LTCF.
    The catch here is - PICS doesn't tell the sheriff for the reason of denial. Doing so would violate Federal law.

    All the sheriff can do is say, "You are denied because you failed the PICS check."


    But I guess he could look a person's records up on his own, but most just roll with PICS.
    RIP: SFN, 1861, twoeggsup, Lambo, jamesjo, JayBell, 32 Magnum, Pro2A, mrwildroot, dregan, Frenchy, Fragger, ungawa, Mtn Jack, Grapeshot, R.W.J.

    Don't end up in my signature!

  3. #33
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    Default Re: PICS background check denial confusion with M2

    Quote Originally Posted by knight0334 View Post
    The catch here is - PICS doesn't tell the sheriff for the reason of denial. Doing so would violate Federal law.

    All the sheriff can do is say, "You are denied because you failed the PICS check."


    But I guess he could look a person's records up on his own, but most just roll with PICS.
    In my case he sort of did both. It took 60 days to get my denial and when I went in to ask him why, he said he couldn't see anything on my record.
    Thank you for keeping me safe.

  4. #34
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    Levittown, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: PICS background check denial confusion with M2

    Can requiring or requesting two references unrelated to the applicant that produces an opinion the applicant's reputation indicates s/he should not be carrying a gun stop the licensing of the applicant? And if so, and challenge does not alter the information, does the sheriff have the responsibility and authority to deny the license?
    There are only two kinds of guns. Those I have and those I want.

  5. #35
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    Chambersburg, Pennsylvania
    (Franklin County)
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    Default Re: PICS background check denial confusion with M2

    Quote Originally Posted by Bang View Post
    Can requiring or requesting two references unrelated to the applicant that produces an opinion the applicant's reputation indicates s/he should not be carrying a gun stop the licensing of the applicant? And if so, and challenge does not alter the information, does the sheriff have the responsibility and authority to deny the license?
    Yes, but in that case there is no "challenge form" submitted, because PICS does not issue denials based on "character and reputation". The Sheriff himself does this, and does, by statute, have the responsibility and authority to do so.

    A denial for that reason requires an appeal to the Court of Common Pleas within 30 days. I do know of a very small number of cases where having an attorney contact the sheriff directly resolved the issue without a court proceeding, but that is exceedingly rare and there is no statutory basis for a sheriff to "change his mind" once a revocation or denial has been initiated.
    Get your "Guns Save Lives" stickers today! PM for more info.

  6. #36
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    Default Re: PICS background check denial confusion with M2

    I believed the structure of my question sufficiently indicated that I was referring to the sheriff's response to the sheriff's application for LTCF. There is provision to challenge a sheriff's unilateral turn-down.
    There are only two kinds of guns. Those I have and those I want.

  7. #37
    Join Date
    May 2007
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    Chambersburg, Pennsylvania
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    Default Re: PICS background check denial confusion with M2

    Quote Originally Posted by Bang View Post
    I believed the structure of my question sufficiently indicated that I was referring to the sheriff's response to the sheriff's application for LTCF. There is provision to challenge a sheriff's unilateral turn-down.
    And I believe that the structure of my answers boil down to:

    "Yes, and yes."
    Get your "Guns Save Lives" stickers today! PM for more info.

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