Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 21 to 29 of 29

Thread: LEOSA

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
    (Philadelphia County)
    Posts
    2,930
    Rep Power
    21474846

    Default Re: LEOSA

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve in PA View Post
    PA is the same way. If a person wants to carry a semi-auto and a revolver, according to MPOETC (run by PSP), I must have them qualify with both handguns.

    Additionally, I have a letter from MPOETC stating that if the controls on the handgun are different, Sig vs Glock, then I must qualify the person with both handguns if they want to carry one or the other. If the person will only carry a Glock, then he can qualify with one Glock, but carry any other Glock (different size or caliber) that he wants.
    Is the course of fire the same as an active annual MPO qualification?

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Easton, Pennsylvania
    (Northampton County)
    Posts
    18
    Rep Power
    0

    Default Re: LEOSA

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve in PA View Post
    You are wrong on the retired requirements. It's not required for active duty officers, but retired officers are required to have documentation that shows they qualified within 12 months. The sheriff's signature, indicating the person passed a background check is not required by LEOSA, but it's the way PA runs the qualifications.

    926C. Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified retired law enforcement officers

    (d) The identification required by this subsection is--

    (1) a photographic identification issued by the agency from which the individual separated from service as a law enforcement officer that identifies the person as having been employed as a police officer or law enforcement officer and indicates that the individual has, not less recently than one year before the date the individual is carrying the concealed firearm, been tested or otherwise found by the agency to meet the active duty standards for qualification in firearms training as established by the agency to carry a firearm of the same type as the concealed firearm; or

    (2)(A) a photographic identification issued by the agency from which the individual separated from service as a law enforcement officer that indicates the person as having been employed as a police officer or law enforcement officer; and

    (B) a certification issued by the State in which the individual resides or by a certified firearms instructor that is qualified to conduct a firearms qualification test for active duty officers within that State that indicates that the individual has, not less than 1 year before the date the individual is carrying the concealed firearm, been tested or otherwise found by the State or a certified firearms instructor that is qualified to conduct a firearms qualification test for active duty officers within that State to have met--

    (I) the active duty standards for qualification in firearms training, as established by the State, to carry a firearm of the same type as the concealed firearm; or

    (II) if the State has not established such standards, standards set by any law enforcement agency within that State to carry a firearm of the same type as the concealed firearm.
    My point is that as a certified instructor in NJ. I give them a piece of paper that I sign. It only shows the course they passed and the date they passed. If an officer worked in PA but retired to Alaska, how are they to obtain:

    ...a photographic identification issued by the agency from which the individual separated from service as a law enforcement officer that identifies the person as having been employed as a police officer or law enforcement officer and indicates that the individual has, not less recently than one year before the date the individual is carrying the concealed firearm, been tested or otherwise found by the agency to meet the active duty standards for qualification in firearms training as established by the agency to carry a firearm of the same type as the concealed firearm;...

    Every single year. This has become an increasing problem in light of court rulings such as Lambert v. Fiorentini, 2020 (1st Cir. 2020).

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Levittown, Pennsylvania
    (Bucks County)
    Posts
    8,095
    Rep Power
    21474855

    Default Re: LEOSA

    Nothing on the "Blue Card" mentions type of firearm. I think it safe to assume that in a casual encounter with an investigating LE, that LE is not going to be in a position to ascertain the added crap described. Get involved in a shooting or arrest involving the gun and the additional information might be uncovered. Ironic that guilty disposition might hang on my having qualified with a G23 which I then carried converted to SIG 357....none of it based on HR218-LEOSA and later amendments.
    Legislating to prevent people's acts is fantasy

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
    (Philadelphia County)
    Posts
    2,930
    Rep Power
    21474846

    Default Re: LEOSA

    Quote Originally Posted by Bang View Post
    Nothing on the "Blue Card" mentions type of firearm. I think it safe to assume that in a casual encounter with an investigating LE, that LE is not going to be in a position to ascertain the added crap described. Get involved in a shooting or arrest involving the gun and the additional information might be uncovered. Ironic that guilty disposition might hang on my having qualified with a G23 which I then carried converted to SIG 357....none of it based on HR218-LEOSA and later amendments.
    In most instances you are correct. But just like we qualify with the weapon (or type) that we will carry, the same goes for carrying off duty and retired.
    Remember not every retired LEO is a gun guy/girl. They might have retired with a Glock but now want to carry something else and they are not very familiar with it and can't hit the side of a barn. Hence the yearly qualification for LEOSA carry.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Levittown, Pennsylvania
    (Bucks County)
    Posts
    8,095
    Rep Power
    21474855

    Default Re: LEOSA

    All predicated by lawyers or fear of lawyers...which is why practice is done with the cartridges carried instead of the cheaper-to-shoot reloads that sufficed for decades.
    Legislating to prevent people's acts is fantasy

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Ercildoun, Pennsylvania
    (Chester County)
    Posts
    4,183
    Rep Power
    21474848

    Default Re: LEOSA

    If I were a retired Police I'd take the advice of Steve in PA. Not only is he an instructor and knows whats required he's a prominent member of Sig Forums too which gives him extree credibility.
    Today Google is the biggest threat to freedom this nation has ever had to face

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Levittown, Pennsylvania
    (Bucks County)
    Posts
    8,095
    Rep Power
    21474855

    Default Re: LEOSA

    I ran across a published piece written by an FBI agent in charge of instructing agents re LEOSA and the laws that sprang from 9/11/01. He pointed out the many expansions occurring by people not involved in actual construction of the law are out of hand.
    The more is better mentality of those involved in decision making down the line are not helping the act accomplish its purpose. Wish I had copied and saved it.

    Keep up the pace, and we (the public) may find ourselves constrained to the motor vehicle we were tested in, and being required to be re-tested in any subsequently acquired vehicle that differs from the approved vehicle. Of course, borrowing a vehicle having differences will be illegal, or a point to be examined in court if it comes to that.

    PA came up with a way to involve oversight by the PSP under the label of standardization state-wide. As usual, the true goal is in the details.
    Legislating to prevent people's acts is fantasy

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    "The Country", Pennsylvania
    (Chester County)
    Posts
    2,123
    Rep Power
    21474846

    Default Re: LEOSA

    There is a LEOSA amendment bill in the judiciary committee now. If passed, it gets rid of mag limits and addresses things LEOSA does not mention such as the federal gun free school zones, federal parks, etc. Honestly, this why I still want national reciprocity even though I’m covered by LEOSA. 1) we should have country wide constitutional carry, but 2) states like NJ still play games regarding LEOSA. Also there are law enforcement agencies that vary state to state. Not all probation/parole officers/agents are peace officers in every state, deputy sheriffs in PA don’t enforce all laws like deputy sheriffs in Texas, school police in Philly are not police officers, some correctional officers are peace officers and others aren’t, etc. A LEO in another state can detain you for hours just to fuck with you if you are not a traditional police officer or state trooper.
    "The Constitution is the guide which I will not abandon. - George Washington

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Levittown, Pennsylvania
    (Bucks County)
    Posts
    8,095
    Rep Power
    21474855

    Default Re: LEOSA

    we should have country wide constitutional carry,
    and all of law enforcement should abide by the constitution under penalty of law.
    Legislating to prevent people's acts is fantasy

Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123

Similar Threads

  1. LEOSA Qualification
    By bordercop in forum Concealed & Open Carry
    Replies: 44
    Last Post: July 3rd, 2020, 11:10 AM
  2. LEOSA and NJ?
    By philadelphia patriot in forum Concealed & Open Carry
    Replies: 132
    Last Post: November 26th, 2018, 08:38 AM
  3. LEOSA training
    By kb3djs in forum Training, Tactics & Competition
    Replies: 40
    Last Post: August 4th, 2018, 12:25 PM
  4. LEOSA
    By Molonlabe76 in forum Concealed & Open Carry
    Replies: 62
    Last Post: March 23rd, 2015, 05:43 PM
  5. Question about LEOSA
    By xd40_jim in forum General
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: March 27th, 2008, 10:08 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •