Need a range and/or ballistics expert

[EZ3]

Looking for someone who can advise our club's Executive Board on a situation we are facing with our indoor range. The current range rules limit muzzle velocity on the range to 855 fps. Just about everything fired in there, including most modern .22 LR ammunition, violates this restriction. We would like an expert opinion on what is actually safe to fire into our existing backstop, to set more realistic limits.

The current NRA Range Source book lists limits for AR500 steel, but our backstop was built before that stuff was invented. We had a local firm test the existing steel, so we know at least the hardness and somewhat the alloy. What type of specialist should we be contacting to determine what is safe for this backstop, and do you know anyone you could recommend?

[gghbi]

Looking for someone who can advise our club's Executive Board on a situation we are facing with our indoor range. The current range rules limit muzzle velocity on the range to 855 fps. Just about everything fired in there, including most modern .22 LR ammunition, violates this restriction. We would like an expert opinion on what is actually safe to fire into our existing backstop, to set more realistic limits.

The current NRA Range Source book lists limits for AR500 steel, but our backstop was built before that stuff was invented. We had a local firm test the existing steel, so we know at least the hardness and somewhat the alloy. What type of specialist should we be contacting to determine what is safe for this backstop, and do you know anyone you could recommend?

How does the existing steel compare with the specs of AR500? If you are NRA affiliated, or not, have you tried contacting somebody in the organization? Might be worth a phone call or email, but not sure who is or is not at home these days.

[Brick]

.45 ACP TARGET semi-wadcutter should run about 750 fps IIRC .45 ACP National Match Hardball Ammo is 850 fps.
38 Special in most commercial loads will be below 855 fps.
.38 S&W (and similar)
.32 S&W Long (and similar)
You might also want to consider FRANGIBLE bullets.

[EZ3]

How does the existing steel compare with the specs of AR500? If you are NRA affiliated, or not, have you tried contacting somebody in the organization? Might be worth a phone call or email, but not sure who is or is not at home these days.

Six plates range between 121 to 184 Brinell. NRA is no help. Too busy patching their public image, I guess.

[Delkal]

A generic 855 FPS rule sounds very conservative. What load were they thinking about when they decided on 855 fps? No older clubs used AR500 steel for backstops and even mild steel can stop most lead pistol bullets. You will need to try and find the thickness of the steel plate and how it is angled.


You should not make any decisions depending on how hard the steel is or the alloy. AR500 is only needed for rifle velocity jacketed rounds. Lead will splatter as soon as it hits even mild steel. I would look over every inch of the backstop and see if it took any damage over the years. If you club is older it would be hard to believe no one snuck in a .22 over the years. If you don't see little dents all over you are probably good for any lead pistol rounds or a .22 rifle.

[EZ3]

A generic 855 FPS rule sounds very conservative. What load were they thinking about when they decided on 855 fps? No older clubs used AR500 steel for backstops and even mild steel can stop most lead pistol bullets. You will need to try and find the thickness of the steel plate and how it is angled.


You should not make any decisions depending on how hard the steel is or the alloy. AR500 is only needed for rifle velocity jacketed rounds. Lead will splatter as soon as it hits even mild steel. I would look over every inch of the backstop and see if it took any damage over the years. If you club is older it would be hard to believe no one snuck in a .22 over the years. If you don't see little dents all over you are probably good for any lead pistol rounds or a .22 rifle.

3/8 plate angled at 45degrees, just like in the NRA Range Source book. Just doesn't happen to be AR500. So, does anybody know who might be able to give an expert opinion on what is safe to shoot on any given steel type of splash plate? Like, written and signed opinion?

[NathanB]

Action target offers range reviews. It may just be indoor ranges but there are several others as well. I did some research on this due to some shenanigans at my club

[Delkal]

Not sure if anyone will give you a signed written inspection and opinion without some big $$'s. Its not worth the liability to an architect or engineer.

To make your board feel better look up some steel plate penetration videos on Youtube. I doubt you will find a standard velocity lead pistol round that can penetrate a 3/8 inch plate straight on. And at a 45 degree angle it is much more resistant.

Deciding if a .22 rimfire is safe should be even easier. I have a small commercial 22 bullet trap and the angled back plate is under 3/16 thick. Not sure of the temper but this trap is rusty and probably at least 40-50 years old. So no AR500 steel. A 3/8 plate of the crappiest steel should easily stop a 22 rimfire. I think the best way to determine if your backstop is safe for a .22 is a careful controlled test. Get a short barreled pistol and fire it at the backstop with a standard velocity round. Then look closely at where it hit and see if there is anything other than a lead smear. Then repeat it with a high velocity round in the pistol, then a standard velocity round in a rifle, then a high velocity round in a rifle. I don't think you see see any damage but if you see any deflection or even the slightest dent it is not safe.

[Rosco the Iroc]

Nice CO2 BB Red Rider/paintball range you have.

Who built it? Any Spec's on the build?