Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Default Can I take an NFA lower with a rifle upper out of state without ATF approval.

    I'm considering taking one of my rifles and submitting it to turn it into a SBR by adding a short barreled upper.

    If I wanted to put the rifle upper back on it could I then take it out of state without ATF approval?
    "No, it's just a machine. I'm the weapon." - Jack Harper in Oblivion

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Can I take an NFA lower with a rifle upper out of state without ATF approval.

    Quote Originally Posted by QuackXP View Post
    I'm considering taking one of my rifles and submitting it to turn it into a SBR by adding a short barreled upper.

    If I wanted to put the rifle upper back on it could I then take it out of state without ATF approval?

    No. Once the serialized lower is registered as an SBR, it is subject to all those out-of-state travel notifications to NFA Branch in Martinsburg, WV, regardless of what upper is installed, or no upper installed.

    You can remove the registered SBR lower from the NFA, but you forfeit the $200 transfer tax. Putting it back on the NFA registry requires another Form 1 approval and $200.

    Noah
    Currently seeking a sufficiently witty statement for 2020.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Can I take an NFA lower with a rifle upper out of state without ATF approval.

    I disagree with Noah, but I'll have to do some research to back that up
    "It seems that the Constitution is more or less guidelines than actual rules"
    My feedback: http://forum.pafoa.org/showthread.php?t=305685

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Can I take an NFA lower with a rifle upper out of state without ATF approval.

    "It seems that the Constitution is more or less guidelines than actual rules"
    My feedback: http://forum.pafoa.org/showthread.php?t=305685

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Can I take an NFA lower with a rifle upper out of state without ATF approval.

    This is one of those things I wouldn’t want to tempt fate on. I’ve got enough of them I’d just take a different one or file the 5320

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Can I take an NFA lower with a rifle upper out of state without ATF approval.

    Quote Originally Posted by NathanB View Post
    This is one of those things I wouldn’t want to tempt fate on. I’ve got enough of them I’d just take a different one or file the 5320
    Well that's fine & nothing wrong with that, but it's not like you're carrying a Ghost gun with no serial number.

    You're basically converting a SBR back into a legal length rifle, no different than carrying a factory bought rifle. The ATF is clear on this, and it won't raise the eyebrows of regular LE anymore than a factory gun would
    "It seems that the Constitution is more or less guidelines than actual rules"
    My feedback: http://forum.pafoa.org/showthread.php?t=305685

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Can I take an NFA lower with a rifle upper out of state without ATF approval.

    Quote Originally Posted by ExFlyinguy View Post
    Well that's fine & nothing wrong with that, but it's not like you're carrying a Ghost gun with no serial number.

    You're basically converting a SBR back into a legal length rifle, no different than carrying a factory bought rifle. The ATF is clear on this, and it won't raise the eyebrows of regular LE anymore than a factory gun would
    This is what I though. I may make a request directly to the ATF similar to this one and with any additional questions when it comes time to build a SBR. So I can have a letter with my name on it.
    "No, it's just a machine. I'm the weapon." - Jack Harper in Oblivion

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Can I take an NFA lower with a rifle upper out of state without ATF approval.

    Quote Originally Posted by ExFlyinguy View Post
    I have someplace saved on a hard drive in one of the computers an NFA Branch letter from ~2011-2012 that states the exact opposite regarding an NFA-registered AR15 SBR with a 16"+ upper attached. Before being transported across state lines, NFA Branch had to be notified of the traveling registered SBR lower with temporarily-attached 16+" upper.

    BUT, the ATF has reversed itself so many times in NFA Branch letters I would not be surprised if the question was asked again, that whomever writes in response would write it stating what is written in Pilot's linked letter.

    The few times that I've taken ANY of my SBRs across state lines, I let NFA Branch know on their form, explaining the circumstances in detail, and they never said "Don't bother."

    Noah
    Currently seeking a sufficiently witty statement for 2020.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Can I take an NFA lower with a rifle upper out of state without ATF approval.

    Quote Originally Posted by Noah_Zark View Post
    I have someplace saved on a hard drive in one of the computers an NFA Branch letter from ~2011-2012 that states the exact opposite regarding an NFA-registered AR15 SBR with a 16"+ upper attached. Before being transported across state lines, NFA Branch had to be notified of the traveling registered SBR lower with temporarily-attached 16+" upper.

    BUT, the ATF has reversed itself so many times in NFA Branch letters I would not be surprised if the question was asked again, that whomever writes in response would write it stating what is written in Pilot's linked letter.

    The few times that I've taken ANY of my SBRs across state lines, I let NFA Branch know on their form, explaining the circumstances in detail, and they never said "Don't bother."

    Noah
    If I was taking the SBR length upper across state lines I know I would need to. I have another lower its not that big of a deal. Once I get my lower done I will write a letter to the ATF asking all the questions I want and hopefully get one back that I can keep with my range bag at all times.
    "No, it's just a machine. I'm the weapon." - Jack Harper in Oblivion

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
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    (Washington County)
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    Default Re: Can I take an NFA lower with a rifle upper out of state without ATF approval.

    Quote Originally Posted by QuackXP View Post
    If I was taking the SBR length upper across state lines I know I would need to. I have another lower its not that big of a deal. Once I get my lower done I will write a letter to the ATF asking all the questions I want and hopefully get one back that I can keep with my range bag at all times.
    Supposedly by law, the ATF must respond within one year of being asked a question. The one and only time I asked the ATF to clarify something, it was one year to the day to get a response.

    Keep us updated on how long it takes.
    Washington County Machine Guns & Tactical Range -- CMP Affliated Club -- 07/02 FFL/SOT & Type 20 FEL & Pending 10/02 FFL/SOT
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