Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Default Modern Munitions- Somewhat of a hassle with transfer- ended up OK.

    So, I've used Modern Munitions in Penndel, PA as my online purchase FFL. Relatively easy because most big online gun shops like brownell's, buds, etc already have their info on file and they charge a decent amount less (albeit still too much IMO) for online transfers than most in the area.

    Ordered gun from Bud's. Took a week to clear due to ACH payment to get "cash price". Gun ships, arrives at Modern Munitions thursday 3/19, signed for at 12pm.
    Unfortunately, people already panic buying.
    I call around 3:45 PM. They're supposed to be open till 5. Young lady answers, a little attitude, gun's not ready, call back tomorrow.

    So I do.

    I call back friday, 3/20. This time earlier- around 10:45. The owner picks up. He sounds panicky, I explain I need to pick up my online purchase from bud's. He says he's only doing transfers from 11-12 and if I want my gun I better get there ASAP. I leave work, drive there, go in, he says "what are you here for" I tell him, "to pick up my gun, I called about 15 minutes ago." He says "yeah but did someone call you?" I said, "i just spoke directly to you on the phone (I know it was him I spoke to on the phone from previously speaking with him before) and you said to get here now. So I left work early to get here."
    "OK well whats the name, what's the gun". I answer him. He checks briefly in the back- It's not even open, hasn't been put in our books. I can't transfer it. I said, well what do you want me to do? You just told me to "get here now" and I did, and now you're not going to transfer it? He throws his hands up, says with an attitude, "Well I can ship it back to buds if you want!" I say no. Look, I understand it's crazy right now. I ask him if he's going to charge a storage fee if they get shut down and he says absolutely not. He says "maybe, if they don't shut me down today, I'll come in saturday while they're closed and do these transfers, I'm not sure. Call me tomorrow."

    Called him saturday- no dice.
    .Gov shut everything down over the weekend and into monday.

    Update 3/24/20: I called the owner yesterday evening to see if he was aware that the governor now included provisions for FFL's to stay open. He was not aware, and said he'd look into it. He then said even if that's the case, he's not sure if he's going to resume doing transfers yet, if at all this week, and not sure his employees or himself "want a thousand people coming through" right now, which is understandable. He seemed to indicate he's not as interested in that part of business right now and mentioned something about "I'd rather have my employees back in here making ammunition".
    He also said, and I quote, "I'm not sure why people think they NEED to have their gun right away. I've had people show up literally right after their gun gets here expecting it to be transferred."

    I explained that's not the case, I ordered this before the pandemic hit, and it was unfortunate that it arrived a week ago when it did, and that I did not expect to get it immediately but rather wanted to have some sort of plan, at least, for how I could come and pick it up as I have a lot of money into it and about $700 worth of parts for it sitting in my house not being used. He doesn't seem to have a plan right now. I also asked him, if he's not willing to do the transfer right now, if he'd be willing to ship to another FFL who would, and he said "I guess so, but I don't think too many of them are going to want to do it either."

    Update 3/26/20:
    They called me to schedule a time to pickup my firearm. I made an apt for 4:30 pm, called in the morning to make sure this time, they confirmed. I got there on time, and ended up waiting a while not because of them but because of PICS- not their fault.
    The owner was there, I talked to him for about an hour while we waited for pics. He was pretty nice. Still, rough around the edges and customer service is not his specialty. I honestly don't think I'll do a transfer there again, but reasonably priced options in Bucks county are few. I did end up getting my gun, but it was quite a process. At the same time, it was during this pandemic crap, so who knows. I'm just trying to be as fair as I can here.
    Last edited by mccula; March 26th, 2020 at 11:44 PM. Reason: updated
    Genesis 27:3
    Exodus 34:6-7

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Modern Munitions- So far, a hassle with transfer- will update if that changes

    Just another poor businessman, like the millions of others in every industry. Unfortunately, you're kind of screwed as he has the gun you paid for. PICS is a mess, but at least you have until Monday now. Hopefully he'll work with you. Did you fill out the 4473? I think you can fill that out and leave. Then when he gets the approval you can go pick it up.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Modern Munitions- So far, a hassle with transfer- will update if that changes

    Quote Originally Posted by mccula View Post
    So, I've used Modern Munitions in Penndel, PA as my online purchase FFL. Relatively easy because most big online gun shops like brownell's, buds, etc already have their info on file and they charge a decent amount less (albeit still too much IMO) for online transfers than most in the area.

    Anyway, I ordered a gun from Bud's about two weeks ago. It took a week to clear because I did the online ACH payment for their discounted "cash price." Wouldn't do that again. It finally ships, and arrives at Modern Munitions and is signed for Thursday, 3/19. GREAT- right in the middle of panic buying. I call thursday at around 3:45 PM. They're supposed to be open till 5. The young lady answers the phone, and with an attitude, when I ask if my gun is ready to be picked up since it was signed for at 12, says "well we are closing at 4." I said, OK, but my gun was signed for at 12- is it ready? She says call back tomorrow.
    So I do.
    I call back friday, 3/20. This time earlier- around 10:45. The owner picks up. He sounds panicy. I explain I called yesterday, they said to call today and ask about it. He says "if you want it you better get here now- I'm only going to do transfers from 11-12 but if you want it get here now, cause otherwise you might not be able to get it for who knows how long due to the pending shut down." OK, no problem. I make an excuse (which I felt AWFUL doing) and leave work, drive there, go in, he says "what are you here for" I tell him, "to pick up my gun, I called about 15 minutes ago." He says "yeah but did someone call you?" I said, "i just spoke directly to you on the phone (I know it was him I spoke to on the phone from previously speaking with him before) and you said to get here now. So I left work early to get here."
    "OK well whats the name, what's the gun". I answer him. He checks briefly in the back- It's not even open, hasn't been put in our books. I can't transfer it. I said, well what do you want me to do? You just told me to "get here now" and I did, and now you're not going to transfer it? He throws his hands up, says with an attitude, "Well I can ship it back to buds if you want!" I say no. Look, I understand it's crazy right now. I ask him if he's going to charge a storage fee if they get shut down and he says absolutely not. He says "maybe, if they don't shut me down today, I'll come in saturday while they're closed and do these transfers, I'm not sure. Call me tomorrow."

    I understand the hype right now. I get the panic buying and all that. I also understand there was apparently some miscommunication here, however at the same time, he TOLD me to "get here right now", and I left work to do so, and he tells me "there's nothing he can do." That, IMO, is terrible customer service. I'm not an FFL, I don't know how long it takes to "put a firearm in their books" to do the transfer, so I'm willing to give some leeway here on that aspect, but at the same time, if I was in his position, I would have at least offered to expedite it and have it done by end of day. I'm pretty pissed right now.



    TL, DR: Owner told me to come to store to pick up my online ordered gun for transfer. I get there immediately to be told it's not ready and he refuses to transfer gun at that time. Owner states he may POSSIBLY come in on day off to do transfers if not shut down. Will update if that happens.
    I read a lot of bitching. We have 24hrs to put it in the book. BUT that being said- yea he's 100% in the wrong to tell you to come on down right now and then blow you off. As for Buds you got what you paid for fuck that place.
    TriggerTime LLc 01 FFL STILL OPEN!!! NRA CRSO/Pistol/Rifle/Shotgun inst.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Modern Munitions- So far, a hassle with transfer- will update if that changes

    Buds actually shipped the gun as soon as the payment cleared on their end. No bad on their part whatsoever.

    Update: I just got off the phone with him. He says the state police came to his shop yesterday and told him if he processed any new PICS inquiries today he could lose his license. Sounds like they scared him into not doing any more business, which SUCKS, because I am 99% sure what they told him is a lie. But I understand where he is coming from. This is just all really bad timing. I understand that as well. It just is an all around bad situation since there's literally nothing I can do but wait and hope something changes.
    Genesis 27:3
    Exodus 34:6-7

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Modern Munitions- So far, a hassle with transfer- will update if that changes

    Quote Originally Posted by esh21167 View Post
    Just another poor businessman, like the millions of others in every industry. Unfortunately, you're kind of screwed as he has the gun you paid for. PICS is a mess, but at least you have until Monday now. Hopefully he'll work with you. Did you fill out the 4473? I think you can fill that out and leave. Then when he gets the approval you can go pick it up.
    Nope. He wouldn't so much as let our conversation go any further on friday. Didn't offer for me to fill the form out. He was stressing out, Which I completely understand given the hard reality of going from zero to 60 overnight and all. But yeah, I talked to him today and I have a bad, bad feeling he's gonna put all of his transfers on the back burner behind the orders he apparently has that he can't fill yet. We shall see. I can say, he was kind enough to answer the phone and talk through his end of what's going on with me today (Saturday) but this whole situation just sucks. I do feel for him as a small business owner, but at the same time I'm now stuck in this weird place of being a customer for a transfer only, which I feel is probably a lot lower on his priority list if and when he's able to resume doing PICS checks.
    Genesis 27:3
    Exodus 34:6-7

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Modern Munitions- So far, a hassle with transfer- will update if that changes

    I've done a couple of transfers through John over the years, as well as buy his ammo. The ammo is good stuff, but I can absolutely assure you John is anything but a people person.

    I think there is a lot of bad communication on this all around. John could and should have done a better job in communicating his policies for online transfers and the current issues with PSP/PICS being overloaded. He was also wrong in telling the OP to come to the shop, then not performing the transfer when he showed up.

    The OP, however, seems ignorant in the rules/courtesies involved in having firearms shipped to a shop. I know it's his property and he wants it ASAP, but as Rosco pointed out, the FFL has 24 hours to log it into the system. Just because the gun was delivered to the shop doesn't mean it's ready to be transferred.

    I see it all the time at gun shops. Courier delivers gun to FFL, customer gets email delivery confirmation. Customer calls or shows up at FFL minutes later and demands his gun, which is still in the sealed Fedex box and hasn't been logged into the bound book yet. FFLs don't have to do online or FTF transfers. It's a courtesy.

    When I buy a gun online, I let the FFL know it's inbound and wait for his call. When he is ready to transfer the gun, he will call me. I've always treated online transfers that way whether I used Modern Munitions, Ron Cole or another storefront FFL. If you're patient and courteous (and the whole damn state isn't losing it's friggin' mind) you'll get the best service and the opportunity to build a good, ongoing relationship with the FFL. If you want instant gratification or your gun RIGHT NOW, get your own FFL or buy it from your LGS.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Modern Munitions- So far, a hassle with transfer- will update if that changes

    Quote Originally Posted by mccula View Post
    Buds actually shipped the gun as soon as the payment cleared on their end. No bad on their part whatsoever.

    Update: I just got off the phone with him. He says the state police came to his shop yesterday and told him if he processed any new PICS inquiries today he could lose his license. Sounds like they scared him into not doing any more business, which SUCKS, because I am 99% sure what they told him is a lie. But I understand where he is coming from. This is just all really bad timing. I understand that as well. It just is an all around bad situation since there's literally nothing I can do but wait and hope something changes.
    I don't get this. Even IF Wolf's (illegal) mandate were in place, hasn't it been postponed until Monday. And PICS is currently operational, right?

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Modern Munitions- So far, a hassle with transfer- will update if that changes

    Logging a gun into a bound book isnt like digging your own grave with bare hands. Lets be real here. My lgs will do it right away. Now yes it was a madhouse but still it should have been done right then if the circumstance was described accurately. This is why you pay extra for internet even though the ffl has no inventory cost. The margins on new guns vs internet transfers has to make the internet a more profitable transaction unless the ffl is doing it at the same price as their own inventory. Few do that.
    The Gun is the Badge of a Free Man

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Modern Munitions- So far, a hassle with transfer- will update if that changes

    Quote Originally Posted by PHLJJS View Post
    The OP, however, seems ignorant in the rules/courtesies involved in having firearms shipped to a shop. I know it's his property and he wants it ASAP, but as Rosco pointed out, the FFL has 24 hours to log it into the system. Just because the gun was delivered to the shop doesn't mean it's ready to be transferred.
    If you re-read my post, I stated that I had called the day it arrived, as I knew it was going to be crazy. I just wanted to put it on their radar. I didn't go to the store until the following day, which was 24 hours. And I didn't just arrive there, I called, he said to come over NOW if I wanted to pick it up. I totally understand there's a process- and like I said multiple times- I also understand it's crazy times right now. Knowing that, can you blame me for wanting to try and get as ahead of the curve as I could before he got shut down, as he is now?

    Quote Originally Posted by PHLJJS View Post
    FFLs don't have to do online or FTF transfers. It's a courtesy.
    Yes, I understand this. But if an FFL is truly doing it "as a courtesy", they're not charging $25. In fact, I know of one in-house FFL who offered to transfer up to three firearms for $20. I didn't use that person because it's generally easier to just click on modern munitions on the buds, or brownells, etc website as my FFL. Yes it's a courtesy, but he's also making $20 for about 10 minutes worth of "work."
    In all honesty, it can be easier to complete a transfer than it can to sell 1 box of ammo to a new shooter, if you think about it. They would have questions, may need the differences between calibers, JHP vs FMJ, brass vs steel, etc explained. That could easily cost the business owner more than 10 minutes to explain. And they're only going to make what, $3-4 on that box of ammo. He's making $20 off each transfer in this case.

    Quote Originally Posted by PHLJJS View Post
    If you're patient and courteous (and the whole damn state isn't losing it's friggin' mind) you'll get the best service and the opportunity to build a good, ongoing relationship with the FFL. If you want instant gratification or your gun RIGHT NOW, get your own FFL or buy it from your LGS.
    I was very patient and courteous- in fact, I explained on Friday, when HE messed up- caused me to LEAVE WORK unnecessarily for nothing- and then didn't offer to really make it right- that I understood how crazy things are right now. Either way you cut this up, that was a POS move by him to not complete the transfer then and there. And now my $750 gun is stuck with him for most likely the duration of the pandemic.
    Other shops are "open by appointment". Others are still running PICS checks on items customers have paid for.
    I'm honestly worried at this point about multiple things- such as him sending it back to buds, as he mentioned that twice, or if he gets COVID, or if they're shut down for 8 weeks- who knows.
    Genesis 27:3
    Exodus 34:6-7

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Modern Munitions- So far, a hassle with transfer- will update if that changes

    Quote Originally Posted by esh21167 View Post
    I don't get this. Even IF Wolf's (illegal) mandate were in place, hasn't it been postponed until Monday. And PICS is currently operational, right?
    Correct- but I guess whoever this state trooper was lied to him about this and threatened him. I wasn't going to keep pressing the issue with the guy on the phone.
    Genesis 27:3
    Exodus 34:6-7

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