Dealing with AAC. My Customer Service Nightmare.

[NuclearSociety]

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Situation resolved. Unable to replace a baffle, I am getting a class 02 manufacturer to replace the core. AAC has sent me some extra non regulated parts as compensation.

I have been posting anonymously on Reddit and on SilencerTalk forums in regard to my experience with AAC (Advanced Armament Corp.).
However, because I now have to spend a load of money on an outside source to have my suppressor functional again and because of the atrocious treatment I received from their "customer service" tech team, I am sharing my story with my actual username on the PAFOA.

I am deciding to share my story on why I will NEVER buy AAC products again,
and why I also recommend that you never deal with AAC or buy their products also.

If you wish to take the time to read my story, I will outline it below along with my word for word documented interactions with AAC support.

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My story starts out I buy my suppressor from silencershop and have it shipped to my local range that also does class III transfers and I am allowed to fire it there too .

It was an amazing deal that silencershop was running, $400 for an AAC (Advanced Armament Corp.) Ti-Rant 9 9mm suppressor.
That plus my tax stamp ($200), and my Trust ($100) and my transfer free from my class III ($100) put me into the class III stamp ownership for a total of $800 total, NOT BAD!

I took the suppressor to the range a lot and found that it tended to unscrew itself from the barrel and loosen a lot so I bought a heat resistant (tactical black) oven mitt to take to the range with me to be able to retighten it to the barrel of my Glock 19 (with threaded lone wolf barrel) host gun. After many trips to the range, I go back one day and screw it on as normal, start shooting some of my Hush 9mm (from Freedom Munitions, 147 grain subsonic 9mm). It was not even a full magazine and I feel a huge pressure and small flecks of unburnt powder on my face and my gun feels lighter! I look at the barrel and only see the booster attached! There's no suppressor!!!!

What seems to have happened was, the pressure somehow blew off the suppressor from the booster assembly! My can took a flying leap downrange (live at the time, indoor public range) tumbling end over end and lodging itself into the cardboard target holder! I Initially thought I had a baffle strike and the suppressor was dead, but alas it was not.

I brought the target back to my station with the controls and informed the range staff of what happened. They would not shut the range down and stated they would collect whatever they could find and call me to come and get it after hours or the next morning. Long story short I had everything back except one baffle! I figured I would eventually contact AAC and send it in to get it fixed and looked over to see why it decided to take a flying leap down range, as it was not the entire suppressor, it separated at the booster and suppressor tube.

I tossed the suppressor in the safe where it had sat for a few months as I was just starting my college classes and would have no time to go to the range anyway.

That is where my second half of my story starts, my interaction with AAC customer service.

Please see my interactions with them below:

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• 
  RED IS ME
  BLUE IS AAC
  GREEN IS BATFE
  
  Dec 2 - 3:03 PM ME <ME> to techinfo
  Hello, I have a Ti-Rant 9 suppressor I bought a few years ago. It has unscrewed itself at the range and shot itself off of the booster of my 9mm glock 19 (with threaded lone wolf barrel) They were able to recover all but 1 baffle and I was wondering how I would go about getting my suppressor inspected and possibly repaired if need be. I initially thought it exploded when I didn't see it on the end of the gun, fearing a baffle strike, but i can reassemble it no problem just am missing 1 stack it seems. I originally bought it from Silencershop.com on a deal they ran and had it delivered to and transfered to me through my class 3 dealer at (GUNSHOP). It actually happened a few months ago and has been sitting in my safe since, only because I'm in school for (BLANK) and am working full time at (BLANK), this is the first free moment I have to ask.
  Thank you. ME.
  
  Dec 2 - 5:27 PM AAC Support Service Ticket Response
  We can bring it in and repair it, however we can not replace the baffle that was lost. Baffles are NFA items and we can not add nor remove baffles on silencers.
  Thank you and best regards, AAC Customer Services
  
  Dec 2 - 6:34 PM to techinfo
  OK that's no problem, how would it be repaired though if it's missing a baffle? I just called the range and they said they've remember the incident and they did not find anything else out on the range the only baffles they found or the ones that they held and gave back to me, as the range was still currently live when the incident happened. It's an indoor pistol range. How would I go about getting this back to you to be repaired? Well it's still function normally?
  Thanks. ME
  Sent from my iPhone
  
  Dec 6 - 9:03 AM to techinfo
  I was speaking to someone in the customer service through email about my TiRant 9, and I was told it would need to be sent in for repair and I never heard back after my last email? Please see my correspondence from december 2nd below:
  [REMOVED AS ITS REPETITIVE]
  
  Dec 6 - 5:20 PM to me AAC Support Service Ticket Response
  Good Afternoon, We can bring it in and fix everything that we have but it will be sent back to you still missing 1 baffle. The ATF will not let us replace baffles at will.
  Thank you and best regards, AAC Customer Services
  
  Dec 6 - 8:48 PM to techinfo
  Is there any way I can get a new baffle? Can I do a form 4 $200 tax stamp for a new baffle? Right now I have a useless suppressor as it is missing a baffle..... or are you guys able to cut it down and rethread it it will just have a total of 7 instead of 8? Sorry to keep emailing you but I am looking for solutions as I am stuck with a $1000 tube that can do nothing unless I can find a solution to be able to use it again.
  
  Dec 6 - 9:09 PM ME <ME to BATFE> to NFA <Fire.Tech(AT)usdoj.gov>
  Hello, I bought and have registered a Ti-Rant 9 (9mm) suppressor made by AAC, and while at an indoor range that has a class III dealer I had the can come apart and go flying down the live range. They said I could not go down range while they were open and collected the parts for me and returned them to me after. The problem is they said they found all the parts except one baffle and they think the baffle shattered when it hit the ground (as the missing baffle was aluminum) and is now part of all of the bullet fragments and other junk that make up the sand and other material backstop they use. I contacted the manufacturer AAC and they stated they will not replace the baffle and have offered no solution as to how I can make my suppressor functional again. My question is, are they allowed to repair my suppressor by adding a new baffle, or cutting the tube down or rethreading and adding a longer end cap so that all of the baffles inside are held tightly together so I can have the suppressor functional again? Or if not who is allowed to modify it in such a way? Or can I somehow have the baffle replaced? This is my first and only NFA item I own and I am really searching for guidance as I don't want to make a mistake but I also don't want to have a very expensive non-operational suppressor. Thank you for your time and consideration.
  ME
  
  December 7, 2016 7:55 AM
  From: NFA <Fire.Tech(AT)usdoj.gov>
  Sent: Wednesday, December 7, 2016 7:55 AM
  To: Firearms & Ammunition Technology Division
  <firarmstech(AT)atf.gov>
  Subject: FW: Replacement Suppressor Baffle?
  8:20 AM
  FYI
  A person who is licensed under the GCA to manufacture firearms and who has paid the SOT to manufacture NFA firearms may replace a component part or parts of a silencer. Repairs may not be done if they result in removal, obliteration, or alteration of the serial number as this would violate 18U.S.C. section 922(k). If a silencer part bearing the serial number, other than the outer tube, must be replaced, the new part must be marked with the same serial number as the replacement part. Reference ATF Publication 5320.8, National Firearms Handbook (pg. 175)
  
  Dec 7 - 9:06 AM ME <ME> to techinfo
  I am really sorry to keep emailing you like this but I just contacted the BATFE to get clarification to see if I can have the suppressor repaired and this was their response, I would like to RMA the suppressor to you for repair, Please advise how I should go about doing so.
  Thank you!
  ME
  -Forwarded message FROM ATF attached to them
  
  Dec 7 - 11:06 AM to me AAC Support Service Ticket Response TO ME-
  It wouldn't be safe to fire missing a baffle due to all the open space that will be at the end of the silencer. We can repair what is there, so if a baffle was dammage or so we could replace that baffle.
  Thank you and best regards, AAC Customer Services
  
  Dec 7 - 12:19 PM techinfo(AT)advanced-armament.com to me AAC Support Service Ticket Response
  Good Morning, We can not sell the baffles by law.
  Thank you and best regards, AAC Customer Services
  
  Dec 7 - 12:21 PM techinfo(AT)advanced-armament.com to me AAC Support Service Ticket Response
  The repair is not the issue it is the missing baffle
  Thank you and best regards, AAC Customer Services
  
  Dec 7 - 2:51 PM ME <ME> to techinfo
  Please excuse me if I seem like I am being curt, but I feel like we keep going in circles.... I contacted the BATFE and they have stated that the internal parts can be replaced by "A person who is licensed under the GCA to manufacture firearms and who has paid the SOT to manufacture NFA firearms may replace a component part or parts of a silencer." I included my interaction with them below. You offer a lifetime warranty, and I have included questions thus far about setting up an RMA to have the suppressor repaired. So in short you are telling me my suppressor is now non functional, You will not modify the suppressor by cutting the tube down to make the end cap remove the space, I cannot return it to you for repair, you will not replace the baffle, and I am basically SOL? I just feel like I have not been getting straight answers? I'm sorry to keep emailing but this is extremely frustrating and I feel as if I am getting nowhere, Where do you recommend I go from here? Please see the email logs below of your responses and my interaction with the BATFE. Our interaction so far has been the following:
  -included their responses to me
  -included email to batfe
  -included forwarded copy of batfe email to me
  
  Thu, Dec 8, 2016 at 5:56 PM
  7 Baffles come in then 7 can go out. If you need 7 for the silencer and have 6 then we send the can with the 6 back out
  Thank you and best regards,
  AAC Customer Services
  
  Thu, Dec 8, 2016 at 10:34 PM
  to techinfo
  Is there a supervisor I can establish contact with? You have stated multiple times replacing this baffle in your factory is against the law which multiple sources including the BATFE have confirmed is not against the law.
  I wish to be put into contact with a supervisor.
  ME
  
  Fri, Dec 9, 2016 at 5:48 PM
  If you call in and speak with anyone they will tell you that yes we can and we do all the time to fix silencers. What you do not understand is if you loose a baffle from a silencer then you are out of luck and nothing we can do. If you bring us 7 busted baffles then we can replace with 7 new. IF YOU HAVE LOST OR MISSING A BAFFLE THEN WE CAN NOT REPLACE IT. WE HAVE TO HAVE %50 OF A BAFFLE COME IN FOR ANY REPLACEMENT. FEEL FREE TO CALL IN AND SPEAK TO JOSH HOOD OR DRU LEE AND THEY CAN EXPLAIN TO YOU THE WAY ADVANCED ARMAMENT COMPANY POLICY IS DONE AND DIRECTED TO DO SO BY OUR COMPLIANCE
  
  This last communication was where they actually stated what they should have told me FROM THE BEGINNING instead of running me around. I will be calling customer service if for nothing more then to explain to a supervisor how abysmal their customer service department is with communicating properly with customers.
  
  UPDATE:
  
  Wed, Dec 28, 2016 at 12:41 PM
  We regret that this situation has escalated to the point it has without satisfactory resolution. It is unfortunate, but until/unless you are able to locate the missing baffle, our hands are tied. Our inability to replace a missing component is consistent with the Remington/AAC NFA compliance department’s current interpretation of guidelines that were arrived at through exhaustive consultation with the NFA branch. We don’t like the situation any more than you do (you are not the first customer to lose silencer parts through mishap), but until NFA branch changes it’s guidelines, or silencers are deregulated, we cannot replace your missing baffle. If you are able to locate said baffle, I’d like to invite you to send your Ti-Rant 9 back to AAC for a full refurbishment with all new components at no cost to you.
  
  Regards,
  Joshua
  
  Wed, Dec 28, 2016 at 4:01 PM
  Hi Joshua.
  
  I am assuming you are the manager Josh Hood who was mentioned in an email to me, I am not sure if this email will get to you, but the issue at this point is that this email you just sent me itself could have resolved this entire situation.
  My problem was with the absolute abysmal customer service interactions I have been subjected to such as being replied to in all caps, not having questions answered, and feeling like I am being "spoken" to in a condescending manner. If I had received a full explanation from the beginning instead of single line responses such as "Good Morning, We can not sell the baffles by law." (Dec 7 - 12:19 PM techinfo), there would be no issue, as that was not even initially my question. I have sought out the services if an independent 02 manufacturer who is going to be performing a re-core service for me for the cose of $375.
  
  If you would like I can forward you the timestamped email interactions I have had or I can even link you to forums where I have since posted the chronological order of interactions informing others of my issue with the way I have been handled as a customer, Again please note my issue at this point was and is not even with my suppressor being repaired, it was how I was responded to multiple times.
  
  Thank you for your time and I hope my email actually reaches you directly.
  
  SIGNED ME
  
  
  Situation resolved. Unable to replace a baffle, I am getting a class 02 manufacturer to replace the core. AAC has sent me some extra non regulated parts as compensation.

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A nice user over at silencertalk "fishman" recommended I contact Joe curtis at Curtistactical(dot)com as he does this for a living (upgrading and repairing suppressors).

So this is not the cheapest solution but it is where I am right now, and I assume I will be extremely pleased with his services!

NOTE:
I have reviewed their warranty and included documents with the suppressor and on their website and nowhere do I see anything about them not repairing or replacing the internal parts whatsoever.

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HOST GUN, 9mm Glock 19 with Lone Wolf Threaded Barrel and Suppressor height night sights.
4.jpg

HOST GUN, 9mm Glock 19 with AAC Ti-Rant 9 attached
5.jpg

What I saw when the tube flew down range.
6.jpg

Missing 1 baffle
7.jpg

How the booster attaches to the tube.
3.jpg

[brian]

fyi, that baffle didn't shatter. alum doesn't work that way. even if it suffered a strike, there will still be at least one rather large piece of it. your range didn't put much effort in looking for the pieces.

[NuclearSociety]

fyi, that baffle didn't shatter. alum doesn't work that way. even if it suffered a strike, there will still be at least one rather large piece of it. your range didn't put much effort in looking for the pieces.

I understand that may have been a factor but that has nothing to do with the treatment from customer service at AAC.

[brian]

yeap i understand that.
however if you have all the pieces it wouldn't have played out the way it did.
did you pressure the range for a better search after the first reply from aac?

[NuclearSociety]

yeap i understand that.
however if you have all the pieces it wouldn't have played out the way it did.
did you pressure the range for a better search after the first reply from aac?

I did but it was months ago, Only recently badgered AAC about warranty repair.
If I had all the pieces I wouldn't have to contact them as there was no baffle strike.

Nothing negates their abysmal customer service and the runaround they gave me, the treatment from them is the worst I have ever dealt with.

I assume I will be happier with the new baffle stack, and I will update when the service is done.

AAC is forever trash in my book, Others on reddit had the same issue with missing baffles with other companies such as Gemtek and had their suppressors repaired to full factory working condition for minimal cost and no hassle.

[Emptymag]

Their first several responses were pretty damned ignorant and not at all helpful.

I've made simple product inquiries that have gotten a more thorough and pleasant response.

[Kramer]

Their customer service and warranty was always horrible.

A few years back my buddy sent back his 9mm can to have the three lug thingy repaired. They said it was a quick repair, but apparently they lost his can in the repair shop and it took over six months to get it back.

[MichaelVain]

It's strange. I've had nothing but great CS from AAC.

It seems from that email that their compliance department (Legal) has directed a company policy in the interest of the business. Their CS can't circumvent Compliance nor should they. CS can't arbitrarily make decisions that go against Compliance.

It seems that they did not explain simply enough for you to understand. CS should have told you after a few emails "Sir, it's AAC's company policy and legal view that we can only repair or replace parts that we receive from the customer."

Evidently, you did not grasp that.

Your problem is not with CS, it's with Compliance.

[Gunsnwater]

Why has nobody else figured this out? It was missing the baffle the whole time. That's why it blew apart. They sold you a defective can.

[39flathead]

I'm just considering getting into the NFA stuff, glad I came upon this thread.
No AAC products for me.
Going by your post and the response from the ATF they (AAC) are just asshats looking to shirk their warranty claim, just like a low end manufacturer I recently had the pleasure to deal with.