PICS confusion

[PA Guns & ammo]

I'm a little confused on this PICS system. Is it only for handguns? I read their was a bill last year to eliminate the PICS and to use only NICS. Can an PA FFL sell a long gun to an individual from another state if they are legally allowed to own firearms and if the long gun is legal in his/her state of residency? I read the sticky's above but I did not know if they were updated or anything has changed. I'm opening a shop here in Great Bend PA and just making sure I got all my ducks in a row.

Thanks, Jamie

[mrat]

All interstate transfers of handguns and long guns must go through FFL in receiving state,no FTF in PA to out-of-staters.You should make sure you understand all FFL rules before you do something that gets you in trouble.

[tl_3237]

I'm a little confused on this PICS system. Is it only for handguns? I read their was a bill last year to eliminate the PICS and to use only NICS. Can an PA FFL sell a long gun to an individual from another state if they are legally allowed to own firearms and if the long gun is legal in his/her state of residency? I read the sticky's above but I did not know if they were updated or anything has changed. I'm opening a shop here in Great Bend PA and just making sure I got all my ducks in a row.

Thanks, Jamie

PICS is for any type of transfers that go through a Pa FFL (handguns or longarms). Yes, an FFL can sell and deliver longarms to residents of another state provided the FFL assures compliance of the state laws both in his own state and that of the out-of-stater. Handguns must be transferred at an FFL of the buyer's state.

18 USC 922(b) It shall be unlawful for any licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to sell or deliver-

(3) any firearm to any person who the licensee knows or has reasonable cause to believe does not reside in (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, does not maintain a place of business in) the State in which the licensee's place of business is located, except that this paragraph (A) shall not apply to the sale or delivery of any rifle or shotgun to a resident of a State other than a State in which the licensee's place of business is located if the transferee meets in person with the transferor to accomplish the transfer, and the sale, delivery, and receipt fully comply with the legal conditions of sale in both such States (and any licensed manufacturer, importer or dealer shall be presumed, for purposes of this subparagraph, in the absence of evidence to the contrary, to have had actual knowledge of the State laws and published ordinances of both States), and (B) shall not apply to the loan or rental of a firearm to any person for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes;

[PA Guns & ammo]

PICS is for any type of transfers that go through a Pa FFL (handguns or longarms). Yes, an FFL can sell and deliver longarms to residents of another state provided the FFL assures compliance of the state laws both in his own state and that of the out-of-stater. Handguns must be transferred at an FFL of the buyer's state.

What do you mean by deliver? Do you mean ship? Let me see if I'm understanding this correctly. Please tell me if I'm right or wrong:

Handgun transfers from PA resident to PA resident must go through an FFL or Sheriff(?).

Long gun transfers from PA resident to PA resident do not have to go through an FFL as long as the buyer is legal to own long guns.

PICS system is used instead of NICS for all long guns and firearms when sold at a PA FFL to PA residents.

All handguns (firearm) that are purchased at a PA FFL either on premise or online from a resident from another state must be legal in the buyer's state and must be shipped to their FFL.

All long guns that are purchased at a PA FFL either on premise or online from a resident from another state must be legal in the buyer's state and must be shipped to their FFL. No long guns allowed to be purchased and picked up on premise when sold to an individual from another state.

Thanks, Jamie

[tl_3237]

What do you mean by deliver? Do you mean ship? Let me see if I'm understanding this correctly. Please tell me if I'm right or wrong:

Handgun transfers from PA resident to PA resident must go through an FFL or Sheriff(?).

Long gun transfers from PA resident to PA resident do not have to go through an FFL as long as the buyer is legal to own long guns.

PICS system is used instead of NICS for all long guns and firearms when sold at a PA FFL to PA residents.

All handguns (firearm) that are purchased at a PA FFL either on premise or online from a resident from another state must be legal in the buyer's state and must be shipped to their FFL.

All long guns that are purchased at a PA FFL either on premise or online from a resident from another state must be legal in the buyer's state and must be shipped to their FFL. No long guns allowed to be purchased and picked up on premise when sold to an individual from another state.

Thanks, Jamie

You are mostly correct except:

FFL longarm sales/transfers can be made to non-residents AND they can take immediate possession from the transferring FFL. For example, you as a Pa FFL can sell at your shop a longarm to an NJ resident provided the firearm is NJ legal and you follow NJ's sales rules (NJFID and CoE) - once the paperwork and background check is complete you hand the longarm over to the purchaser who will then transport back to NJ.

PICS is the point of contact with NICS and includes checks of additional Commonwealth databases. In essence NICS is a subset of the PICS check.

Handgun transfers between Pa residents of specific familial relationships can occur without any FFL/Sheriff involvement. This applies to transfers between grandparents, parent, children and spouses:

18 Pa CS 6111(c) Duty of other persons.--Any person who is not a licensed importer, manufacturer or dealer and who desires to sell or transfer a firearm to another unlicensed person shall do so only upon the place of business of a licensed importer, manufacturer, dealer or county sheriff's office, the latter of whom shall follow the procedure set forth in this section as if he were the seller of the firearm. The provisions of this section shall not apply to transfers between spouses or to transfers between a parent and child or to transfers between grandparent and grandchild.

[pyld]

The name is Field. Wakefield.

[PA Guns & ammo]

You are mostly correct except:

FFL longarm sales/transfers can be made to non-residents AND they can take immediate possession from the transferring FFL. For example, you as a Pa FFL can sell at your shop a longarm to an NJ resident provided the firearm is NJ legal and you follow NJ's sales rules (NJFID and CoE) - once the paperwork and background check is complete you hand the longarm over to the purchaser who will then transport back to NJ.

PICS is the point of contact with NICS and includes checks of additional Commonwealth databases. In essence NICS is a subset of the PICS check.

Handgun transfers between Pa residents of specific familial relationships can occur without any FFL/Sheriff involvement. This applies to transfers between grandparents, parent, children and spouses:

Yeah I was not sure exactly what the law meant for out of staters on long guns. I assume they fill out a PICS form as well? I tried to search for the PICS form online but the only thing I could find is an appeal form when you get a denial.

One thing you are probably wondering is why I do not know the laws of PA clearly and the reason is that I live in NY and I chose to open my business in PA due to the taxes and mainly the stupid infringing laws in NY state.

Thanks, Jamie

[mrat]

Why do the two stickys in firearms classified by Knight and JayBell state that long guns going to another state need to go through a FFL in that state? Is that just for shipping with a buyer not present in PA? So a nonresident can purchase from a PA FFL and take the firearm with him to his home state. Am I reading that right?

[R L Suehr]

Why do the two stickys in firearms classified by Knight and JayBell state that long guns going to another state need to go through a FFL in that state? Is that just for shipping with a buyer not present in PA? So a nonresident can purchase from a PA FFL and take the firearm with him to his home state. Am I reading that right?

You can buy a long gun face to face at an ffl in any state as long as it is legal to possess in both that state and your home state.

[mrat]

So in JayBell's sticky "Pertinent Federal Laws" #1. about FTF must go through FFL in buyer's state is wrong? Did the laws change? Just asking.