Situational awareness and handling your gun while in holster

[gunperson003]

Example situation

The time is late at night where it is already dark, and a person comes up to you and starts talking. For all example its rather a thug or a con man.

What would be the proper thing to do here if he(sorry but I've never seen a female con/thug) doesn't stop walking towards you when you tell him to go away? Would you unsecure the reason and place your hand on it in as an awareness reaction?

[TonyF]

Obtaining a strong hand firing grip on your weapon without a distinct threat indicator is a gray area fraught with legal pitfalls. This is a very real scenario that occurs all too frequently. Based on the actor's reaction and whether he notices what you are doing, it could become a very explosive situation.

His body language, your body language and the manner in which you verbalize commands to him to break contact and whether or not he complies is the chemistry that will determine what happens next.

[gunperson003]

The situation happened to me last night, which I've never had happen before. I paid the guy 13USD to go away. Since now I've experienced the situation, I'll react accordingly. I have thought of certain situations which not to, but I think that would've been a situation to do so.

Obtaining a strong hand firing grip on your weapon without a distinct threat indicator is a gray area fraught with legal pitfalls. This is a very real scenario that occurs all too frequently. Based on the actor's reaction and whether he notices what you are doing, it could become a very explosive situation.

His body language, your body language and the manner in which you verbalize commands to him to break contact and whether or not he complies is the chemistry that will determine what happens next.

[Big Dog]

The situation happened to me last night, which I've never had happen before. I paid the guy 13USD to go away. Since now I've experienced the situation, I'll react accordingly. I have thought of certain situations which not to, but I think that would've been a situation to do so.

You mean he harassed you into giving him $13?? Please explain ...........

[normanvin]

The situation happened to me last night, which I've never had happen before. I paid the guy 13USD to go away. Since now I've experienced the situation, I'll react accordingly. I have thought of certain situations which not to, but I think that would've been a situation to do so.

Huh? what?...........more info please..

[gunperson003]

You mean he harassed you into giving him $13?? Please explain ...........

The guy is a con man. He was just wanting enough money for "gas" so to me that makes 10 bucks. I'd rather give him money to go away when I'm in a situation where I'm not 1) under any street lights 2) not many people passing.

at first I was believing his story about needing help, but towards the end he started saying stupid stuff which clearly wasn't true(cab requiring fare before hand, he has relatives in Alaska, two travel assistance agencies which were in fact not in the direction he pointed*I learned where places where before I came*). I make lots of money anyway, so I hope he spends it on food or rent and not on crack. Okay.. maybe I'm a sucker for feeling sorry for others who are poor.

Anyway, I think next time I'll tell a person to back off very slowly, turn around, and walk away while my hand is on my firearm after I disengage the retention strap. With me, I usually don't do anything unless I've experienced something before or with a friend. Perhaps or perhaps not I'd react if it were a bank robbery in progress, the gun vs bomb guy was part of his country military, I don't have the training.

[Emptymag]

GP,
Tony must have superior "English" decoding skills, because I can't understand what you said in the OP.

Was this a vagrant saying "Hey buddy, I need some money for a sandwich.", or "Yo, my man... my car is out of gas, and I gotta get my daughter to the hospital - can you spare $10 for gas?"

I just can't see a situation where someone intent on doing you harm in the first place would be satisfied with 13 US Dollars. (as opposed to Pesos or Francs?)

I'm glad you are OK, but please explain further.



ETA: I see you explained further as I was typing.
The old, "Money for gas" line... Heh. Welcome to Pittsburgh.

[gunperson003]

I apologize EM, my the capability of thinking in English degrades as I tire. In fact I can only think in Python when I'm dead tired, as I'm used to programming late at night.

GP,
Tony must have superior "English" decoding skills, because I can't understand what you said in the OP.

Was this a vagrant saying "Hey buddy, I need some money for a sandwich.", or "Yo, my man... my car is out of gas, and I gotta get my daughter to the hospital - can you spare $10 for gas?"

I just can't see a situation where someone intent on doing you harm in the first place would be satisfied with 13 US Dollars. (as opposed to Pesos or Francs?)

I'm glad you are OK, but please explain further.

[Autonomous]

The guy is a con man. He was just wanting enough money for "gas" so to me that makes 10 bucks. I'd rather give him money to go away when I'm in a situation where I'm not 1) under any street lights 2) not many people passing.

at first I was believing his story about needing help, but towards the end he started saying stupid stuff which clearly wasn't true(cab requiring fare before hand, he has relatives in Alaska, two travel assistance agencies which were in fact not in the direction he pointed*I learned where places where before I came*). I make lots of money anyway, so I hope he spends it on food or rent and not on crack. Okay.. maybe I'm a sucker for feeling sorry for others who are poor.

Anyway, I think next time I'll tell a person to back off very slowly, turn around, and walk away while my hand is on my firearm after I disengage the retention strap. With me, I usually don't do anything unless I've experienced something before or with a friend. Perhaps or perhaps not I'd react if it were a bank robbery in progress, the gun vs bomb guy was part of his country military, I don't have the training.

OK GP....
First Im glad you did not have an incident. I think that giving someone a little cash to get them to go away may not always be a bad idea. Hell when I walk around a city I keep some change in my left pocket and a few bills in my right. No cash in my wallet. Most of the people asking/demanding money are not out to hurt you. More than likely if they are gonna rob you they will just rush up and do it. With that said treat every situation like a possible attack on you. Keep a distance. Make sure you have your strong side ready. And most of all don't let the person know you are nervous. I feel like confidence goes a long way. Works with wild animals as well as wild people....
Second don't put yourself second because you have make more money. Often people asking for change are looking for the next high. You don't have to help them get there. Don't feel sorry for people because they are poor. It wont do you any good. Equally don't look down on people because they are poor. It is what it is and if you feel like giving a few bucks to some one on the off chance go for it. Hell I felt worse about paying that stupid pittsburgh city work tax than I did giving change to folks on the way to work..
Be careful the next time you have to deal with this situation. Remember if all you have is a hammer then all your problems look like nails....It may be cheeper to give up a little cash than have to pay legal fee's to defend yourself for shooting a person over some pocket change (I am well aware that this statement will not be popular....)
-A

[gunperson003]

Thanks for the reply. The logic you specified is mostly what I used. The main thing it was dark, you never know when the person might have a knife.

I find this funny. I posted the situation on the Anthrocon forum and Kage (Samuel Conway) got angry, disabled my posting privs, and hid the post from public view. Since he is going to be ignorant and not want to talk about it, I'll just talk about it publicly how some people tend to be completely obtuse.

Samuel Conway "ceo@anthrocon.org":
"I understand what you are trying to do, but your postings about firearms
and "how to keep safe" are doing far more harm than good. You're
panicking people and leading them to believe that Pittsburgh is an unsafe
city. The last thing I need to hear is someone saying, "I want to cancel
my membership because I'm afraid to go there."

I'm going to have to remove your board posting access. Please do not try
to get around that by creating alternative accounts. To do so would be to
disinvite yourself from attending the convention.

Please do not contact me about this until at least 1 month after the
convention."

What I'd like to know, what city is "safe"? Is there some city named Pleasantville which has ZERO crime which I don't know about?

http://www.google.com/search?q=drive...ing+pittsburgh

Funny, Pittsburgh is a safe place? I don't think so. Maybe safer than Philly, but its still a large city with muggers, cons, child rapists, and murders just like any other large city out there.

Anyway, I must make my way to Walmart via the bus line right now... No way I'm going to walk/run the 6 miles even though it will only take me 45 min to an hour.

OK GP....
First Im glad you did not have an incident. I think that giving someone a little cash to get them to go away may not always be a bad idea. Hell when I walk around a city I keep some change in my left pocket and a few bills in my right. No cash in my wallet. Most of the people asking/demanding money are not out to hurt you. More than likely if they are gonna rob you they will just rush up and do it. With that said treat every situation like a possible attack on you. Keep a distance. Make sure you have your strong side ready. And most of all don't let the person know you are nervous. I feel like confidence goes a long way. Works with wild animals as well as wild people....
Second don't put yourself second because you have make more money. Often people asking for change are looking for the next high. You don't have to help them get there. Don't feel sorry for people because they are poor. It wont do you any good. Equally don't look down on people because they are poor. It is what it is and if you feel like giving a few bucks to some one on the off chance go for it. Hell I felt worse about paying that stupid pittsburgh city work tax than I did giving change to folks on the way to work..
Be careful the next time you have to deal with this situation. Remember if all you have is a hammer then all your problems look like nails....It may be cheeper to give up a little cash than have to pay legal fee's to defend yourself for shooting a person over some pocket change (I am well aware that this statement will not be popular....)
-A