What would you have done?

**LordTobias** · August 11th, 2014, 07:44 PM

Here are two scenarios that have taken place in the last year (out of five) where I was glad I had my gun on me. I'm curious what you would have done (or think you would have done...) in these situations.

First.
I'm walking home late at night, sometime in January or February. It's cold for most people (between 10 and 20 degrees outside). I'm headed home pretty late from my girlfriend's (now my wife) house and I notice some guy on a bike following me. He follow me about a block, to a street that doesn't have any house fronts. He speeds up enough to get beside me, then slightly in front of me and turns around.

"Yo, big guy. Yo!" I try to ignore him, but he gets louder. "I hate to bother you, but -- "

At that point I could see what I think was the grip of a gun under his coat. Mind you, this is 2 am, and it's dead quiet outside. I turn to my side to square up with him (no chance of running or getting cover on this street, believe you me) while sweeping back my shirt. At this point my hand is on my gun and he kind of freezes, because he has both hands on the handle bars of the bike. He looks like he's tensing up and is ready to make a move for what, again, looks like a gun.

"Move your hands off the handle bars and I'll shoot you" I say to him. He immediately takes off in the other direction on the bike and I never see him again. Honestly, it's lucky I don't really get cold and wasn't wearing a coat. Once I saw the gun grip sticking out of his coat I was glad I didn't have a coat to wrestle with to get to my gun.

How would you guys have handled this situation?

Second.
Three guys come into my store at 6:55 pm (five minutes before close). They've been in the store at least four times in the past casing the store trying to figure out when employees will be alone. Well, I guess I had the luck of the draw there.

Moving on, one guy starts chatting me up about cell phones and plans (I manage two Verizon stores) and tries to keep me distracted. The other two buffoons with him are checking out the security features on the iPhones; most likely to see if they're similar to the other stores since they've stolen a ton of merchandise from other locations.

I come from behind my counter as one of the guys tries to enter the back room. He moves away, and they keep attempting to get behind me. (I later found out that their MO is to jump the store employee and THEN steal the merch.) A few minutes of this bullshit continues, and the second I tell them it's time to go, as I'm closing, they tear down the iPhone display in the store. The first two punks grab one phone, the third one has the fixture fall on him while he's grabbing the second phone. At this point I'm calling the cops and he wrestles himself free. I confront him at the door as he's running out and he makes a threatening comment and runs off.

The detective I spoke to during the next day very plainly said "You should have shot them. You were within your rights to do so." While I think it would be great for these assholes to not be members of society any more, I felt like avoiding a fist fight with three people or shooting one of them was the better choice. They caused something like $4,000 in damages, but no one was injured on either side.

Oh, and all three of them were caught within a couple weeks. Still waiting on the trials. Should be interesting.

What would you guys have done in this case? I might have reacted differently if I actually owned the store (and certainly would have if it was my home), but I saw no point in risking injury for a couple of phones and a display.

**HKusp 45** · August 11th, 2014, 07:53 PM

Situation one I agree except maybe drawing would have been safer considering you have a better chance of him not trying to play quick draw.

Situation 2 of its your place of business but you aren't the owner it depends on whether or not I know my boss was good with shooting them. But then again it beats being jumped and having my sidearm taken.

Good on you either way for living to tell about it, seems to me of your alive you choose well.

**LordTobias** · August 11th, 2014, 08:00 PM

Originally Posted by HKusp 45

Situation one I agree except maybe drawing would have been safer considering you have a better chance of him not trying to play quick draw.

Situation 2 of its your place of business but you aren't the owner it depends on whether or not I know my boss was good with shooting them. But then again it beats being jumped and having my sidearm taken.

Good on you either way for living to tell about it, seems to me of your alive you choose well.

My boss would definitely not be okay with me shooting anyone. Honestly, he's kind of a sissy/bitch, and is terrified of guns.

**Hamltnblue** · August 11th, 2014, 08:07 PM

Situation 1, If followed don't continue to a worse area. move off the sidewalk and get to a position where you can watch him. Phone in left hand and right hand near weapon (or reverse if left handed) If it's nothing no harm no foul.

2nd I can't comment since I'm not familiar with retail but one thing I'd suggest is to invite the boss to the range for a shoot. It seems to change a lot of anti's to pro's once they experience it.

**LordTobias** · August 11th, 2014, 08:21 PM

Originally Posted by Hamltnblue

Situation 1, If followed don't continue to a worse area. move off the sidewalk and get to a position where you can watch him. Phone in left hand and right hand near weapon (or reverse if left handed) If it's nothing no harm no foul.

2nd I can't comment since I'm not familiar with retail but one thing I'd suggest is to invite the boss to the range for a shoot. It seems to change a lot of anti's to pro's once they experience it.

In situation one I would tend to agree, but at that point it's the middle of the night and no one was out. Even if I tried to go a different route I feel like he would have followed me. Given my experience with how long it takes cops to respond, calling the police was the last thing on my mind. I would never give up a free hand if I don't have to, honestly.

The boss would never, ever go. He's absolutely terrified of any kind of "weapon." Hell, he won't even use a box cutter/utility blade. I carry a pocket knife on me (folder with a 3 inch blade) that freaks him out every time he sees me use it to open a box or a package. No amount of explaining has changed his mind on guns "going off on their own all the time." Sad, but true.

**HKusp 45** · August 11th, 2014, 09:22 PM

Originally Posted by LordTobias

No amount of explaining has changed his mind on guns "going off on their own all the time." Sad, but true.

Damn mine must not be doing their job then, when I leave them on thier own they refuse to go off. Hmm let me borrow yours so mine can learn the right way to be.

**LordTobias** · August 11th, 2014, 10:01 PM

hahahaha

Indeed, HK. Indeed.

If it's any explanation, my boss is an extremely nervous guy with Tourette Syndrome.

**FJRMarty** · August 11th, 2014, 11:05 PM

Philly is more like NJ than PA - 50 years ago I could see the writing on the wall so I left NJ for western PA.... That is what I did.

**LordTobias** · August 12th, 2014, 12:21 AM

Originally Posted by FJRMarty

Philly is more like NJ than PA - 50 years ago I could see the writing on the wall so I left NJ for western PA.... That is what I did.

Well, when the timing is appropriate I'd really like to leave Philly. I keep to myself and mind my business, but two store robberies, two attempted muggings and one attempted assault by a group of people is pretty ridiculous in one year for one person. Most of these occurred in the "better parts of the city." I've had way less trouble in the "bad neighborhoods." Go figure.

**wakefield724** · August 12th, 2014, 12:49 AM

Originally Posted by LordTobias

I notice some guy on a bike following me. He follow me about a block, to a street that doesn't have any house fronts. He speeds up enough to get beside me, then slightly in front of me and turns around.

"Yo, big guy. Yo!" I try to ignore him, but he gets louder. "I hate to bother you,

OH MY GOD!!! You met ICEN