Thinking about getting a DE License

[Jay2125]

I was thinking about getting a DE ltcf. I live in Aston which is like 10 min from DE. During the holidays I spend some time there shopping and I always hear about people getting mugged there and such. So my question is how hard is it to obtain a DE license since I live in pa is it a good enough reason because I shop there. Any input will help thanks.

[ChrisF4i]

From what I've heard your best bet would be to get a non-resident Utah permit

http://bci.utah.gov/CFP/CFPHome.html

[ChrisF4i]

.....and yes it is a good enough reason to get one.

[soberbyker]

I was thinking about getting a DE ltcf. I live in Aston which is like 10 min from DE. During the holidays I spend some time there shopping and I always hear about people getting mugged there and such. So my question is how hard is it to obtain a DE license since I live in pa is it a good enough reason because I shop there. Any input will help thanks.

As mentioned getting a Utah non-resident permit is the way to go, I have one as I work in Delaware once a week. In fact it's easier for us non Delaware residents to get a Utah (or Florida) permit to carry in Delaware than it is for a Delaware resident to get a Delaware Permit.

The Utah permit requires a class by a Utah certified instructor. I used:

JEFFREY GOLDBERG ....................... 610-458-5688
e-mail ..............................jsg525@earthlink.net

Jeff gives regular classes and is also willing to do a personal one on one class. I had him come to my home for the class, along with a few other PAFOA members. Give Jeff a call, he'll work with ya to help ya get the permit.

Bill

.

[Johannes_Paulsen]

I think it's odd that Delaware is a "may"-issue state, but has reciprocity with a "shall"-issue state.

Then again, considering that the Bradys live in Delaware, perhaps I should be amazed that Concealed Carry is permitted at all in that State!

Be aware of Delaware laws if you use your Utah permit to carry there. Especially this one:

§ 1457 Possession of a weapon in a Safe School and Recreation Zone; class D, E, or F: class A or B misdemeanor.

(a) Any person who commits any of the offenses described in subsection (b) of this section, or any juvenile who possesses a firearm or other deadly weapon, and does so while in or on a "Safe School and Recreation Zone" shall be guilty of the crime of possession of a weapon in a Safe School and Recreation Zone.

(b) The underlying offenses in Title 11 shall be:

(1) Section 1442. Carrying a concealed deadly weapon; class G felony; class E felony.

(2) Section 1444. Possessing a destructive weapon; class E felony.

(3) Section 1446. Unlawfully dealing with a switchblade knife; unclassified misdemeanor.

(4) Section 1448. Possession and purchase of deadly weapons by persons prohibited; class F felony.

(5) Section 1452. Unlawfully dealing with knuckles-combination knife; class B misdemeanor.

(6) Section 1453. Unlawfully dealing with martial arts throwing star; class B misdemeanor.

(c) For the purpose of this section, "Safe School and Recreation Zone" shall mean:

(1) Any building, structure, athletic field, sports stadium or real property owned, operated, leased or rented by any public or private school including, but not limited to, any kindergarten, elementary, secondary or vocational- technical school or any college or university, within 1,000 feet thereof; or

(2) Any motor vehicle owned, operated, leased or rented by any public or private school including, but not limited to, any kindergarten, elementary, secondary, or vocational-technical school or any college or university; or

(3) Any building or structure owned, operated, leased or rented by any county or municipality, or by the State, or by any board, agency, commission, department, corporation or other entity thereof, or by any private organization, which is utilized as a recreation center, athletic field or sports stadium.

(d) Nothing in this section shall be construed to preclude or otherwise limit a prosecution of or conviction for a violation of this chapter or any other provision of law. A person may be convicted both of the crime of possession of a weapon in a Safe School and Recreation Zone and of the underlying offense as defined elsewhere by the laws of the State.

(e) It shall not be a defense to a prosecution for a violation of this section that the person was unaware that the prohibited conduct took place on or in a Safe School and Recreation Zone.

(f) It shall be an affirmative defense to a prosecution for a violation of this section that the weapon was possessed pursuant to an authorized course of school instruction, or for the purpose of engaging in any legitimate sporting or recreational activity. The affirmative defense established in this section shall be proved by a preponderance of the evidence. Nothing herein shall be construed to establish an affirmative defense with respect to a prosecution for any offense defined in any other section of this chapter.

(g) It is an affirmative defense to prosecution for a violation of this section that the prohibited conduct took place entirely within a private residence, and that no person under the age of 18 was present in such private residence at any time during the commission of the offense. The affirmative defense established in this section shall be proved by the defendant by a preponderance of the evidence. Nothing herein shall be construed to establish an affirmative defense with respect to a prosecution for an offense defined in any other section of this chapter.

(h) This section shall not apply to any law enforcement or police officer, or to any security officer as defined in Chapter 13 of Title 24.

(i) For purposes of this section only, "deadly weapon" shall include any object described in § 222(6) or § 222(11) of this title or BB guns.

(j) The penalty for possession of a weapon in a Safe School and Recreation Zone shall be:
(1) If the underlying offense is a class B misdemeanor, the crime shall be a class A misdemeanor;

(2) If the underlying offense is an unclassified misdemeanor, the crime shall be a class B misdemeanor;

(3) If the underlying offense is a class E, F, or G felony, the crime shall be one grade higher than the underlying offense.

(4) In the event that an elementary or secondary school student possesses a firearm or other deadly weapon in a Safe School and Recreation Zone in addition to any other penalties contained in this section, the student shall be expelled by the local School Board or charter school board of directors for a period of not less than 180 days unless otherwise provided for in federal or state law.

Note especially:

* Del Code tit. 11 sec. 1457 (e), (f) and (g). Basically, it sounds like you can only possess a handgun within a "Safe School and Recreation Zone" if you're "entirely within a private residence" or if you're possessing that weapon "pursuant to an authorized course of school instruction, or for the purpose of engaging in any legitimate sporting or recreational activity."

I do not know if possessing a firearm for self defense constitutes "a legitimate sporting or recreational activity". If someone knows how the Delaware Courts have interpreted this phrase it would be helpful. EDIT: see post below.


* Also be aware of subsection (i), which states that the definition of "deadly weapon" includes the definitions in sec. 222(6) and sec. 222(11). I've copied that below. See especially sec. 222(6)!

(6) "Disabling chemical spray" includes mace, tear gas, pepper spray or any other mixture containing quantities thereof, or any other aerosol spray or any liquid, gaseous or solid substance capable of producing temporary physical discomfort, disability or injury through being vaporized or otherwise dispersed in the air, or any cannister, container or device designed or intended to carry, store or disperse such aerosol spray or such gas or solid.

....

(11) "Firearm" includes any weapon from which a shot, projectile or other object may be discharged by force of combustion, explosive, gas and/or mechanical means, whether operable or inoperable, loaded or unloaded. It does not include a BB gun.

(And, of course, sec. 1457 goes on to say that BB guns are ALSO included in the definition of a "deadly weapon".)


(DISCLAIMER: None of this is legal advice, nor am I creating an attorney-client relationship by posting this information. Please consult an attorney licensed to practice in the State of Delaware for such advice on this issue. These statutes were pulled off official-looking Delaware gov't sites, but I cannot confirm that this is the most up-to-date information, nor am I aware of how Courts have construed these laws.)

[Jay2125]

Thanks for all the info and help guys

[RLS]

You would be best served getting a Utah or Florida permit/license. You will not get a Delaware permit, as you are not eligible. Delaware residents only.





Rick

[Chevmeister]

jay, i live in concord, and i hava fl license. del does not issue so fl or utah is the way to go, if your a hunter with a hunter safety course you can apply right now and have it in 90 days. If you need help pm me.

JKP1187
can you tell me from what you posted what the penalty for carrying a concealed weapon in a school zone is if you have a license?

you are right as far as haveing a bb gun in a school zone is a criminal offence.

[Johannes_Paulsen]

jay, i live in concord, and i hava fl license. del does not issue so fl or utah is the way to go, if your a hunter with a hunter safety course you can apply right now and have it in 90 days. If you need help pm me.

JKP1187
can you tell me from what you posted what the penalty for carrying a concealed weapon in a school zone is if you have a license?

you are right as far as haveing a bb gun in a school zone is a criminal offence.

I do not know for sure, as I do not have the time to do an exhaustive search. This is the only exception:

(f) It shall be an affirmative defense to a prosecution for a violation of this section that the weapon was possessed pursuant to an authorized course of school instruction, or for the purpose of engaging in any legitimate sporting or recreational activity. The affirmative defense established in this section shall be proved by a preponderance of the evidence. Nothing herein shall be construed to establish an affirmative defense with respect to a prosecution for any offense defined in any other section of this chapter.

...but I do not know if Delaware Courts have construed possession of a concealed firearm (pursuant to a license) constitutes a "legitimate sporting or recreational activity".

[offshorebear]

I don't have much to add that hasn't been said here, but www.deloc.org is the closest thing to PAFOA Delaware has. You can open carry there but there are a lot of restrictions.