Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Legality of foregrips on rifles and shotguns

    Quote Originally Posted by Lougotzz View Post
    I don't disagree with you about the safety issue with a loaded gun leaning against a vehicle. I would never do it even if legal. I am talking about the rare extream case that most probably will not happen.
    I just feel if we are free people we don't need to be told or shown how to do every little thing in life.
    It is becoming where we are looked at as total incompetents. I do agree that many people are. But I truly believe that was created for the very purpose to have heavy handed government.

    I have lived in NY for 37 years and have seen this first hand with many things. When it creeps up on you it goes unnoticed. When you leave and see that other places don't need or do what you lived with all your life and the people are doing just fine you get a bit suspect.


    ETA think about all the things that were done 20 -30 years ago and people were just fine.
    Unfortunately our society has devolved in the past 50 years so that people cannot be trusted to do what is moral, apply common sense or take personal responsibility for their actions. Laws are proliferating because, more and more, they address the lowest common denominator portion of that body politic at one end and the schemers and loophole-criminals at the other.
    Last edited by tl_3237; September 9th, 2013 at 10:08 PM.
    IANAL

  2. #22
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    Default Re: Legality of foregrips on rifles and shotguns

    You hit the nail right on the head. I have always said that is the exact reason why we get these type of laws.

    The problem is there are still responsible people who would do just fine as a society with many less laws.

  3. #23
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    Alburtis, Pennsylvania
    (Lehigh County)
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    Default Re: Legality of foregrips on rifles and shotguns

    Quote Originally Posted by RusskyDudesky View Post
    So I went to my local range today up in Peekskill, NY with my Ruger PC4 carbine to spend an hour or so sighting in my new scope and trying out the rifle with a new foregrip I attached to a barrel clamped tri rail adapter. One of the guys there who is a frequent shooter told be that foregrips are supposedly illegal and make my Ruger an "assault rifle". I'm pretty sure I read the SAFE Act correctly and in there it makes no mention of foregrips being illegal except on pistols. Also, the range only allows for loading of 5 rounds in the magazine even though state law says that a maximum of 10 rounds may be loaded at the range and 7 rounds everywhere else, so what was he harping on about that it's illegal? How are the laws in PA in regards to foregrips on rifles and shotguns? As far as I'm concerned, I didn't find any verbiage stating that a foregrip on a long gun makes it an "assault weapon". Nothing annoys me more than peopleb who don't mind their own business at the range and start lecturing me on what's legal and what's not when they themselves are not knowledgable of the state gun laws.
    I guess he knows more then you do, nothing irritates me more then a know it all that spreads misinformation. Maybe you need to check your ego at the door and realize that maybe you don't know everything.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mirlen View Post
    Suggest you delete this post and move.
    No, i think he should stay in NY looking at a lot of his posts hes been spreading misinformation and has the i know it all attitude, we have enough NY and NJ implants in PA we don't need anymore.
    IANAL

  4. #24
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    Danielsville, PA, Pennsylvania
    (Northampton County)
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    Default Re: Legality of foregrips on rifles and shotguns

    Quote Originally Posted by tl_3237 View Post
    Unfortunately our society has devolved in the past 50 years so that people cannot be trusted to do what is moral, apply common sense or take personal responsibility for their actions. Laws are proliferating because, more and more, they address the lowest common denominator portion of that body politic at one end and the schemers and loophole-criminals at the other.
    It's not about safety. It's about jerk offs hopping out of thier cars when they see a big buck and using the vehicle as a stabalizer to take a shot.

    They DO NOT want you discharging your weapon near the road, parking area, or any other place random people could be milling around. So they wrote the law that a loaded gun can not be touching the car.

    There were tons of people doing stupid things hundreds and thousands of years ago. The issue is that it is almost impossible to get laws taken off the books, so as new things come and go there are only more laws.

    There are many laws on the books that are uninforced, redicoulous, and no longer valid.

    You can thank the war of drugs for most of your issues. It has introduced a school of thought that the only way you can stop something from happening is to criminalize it. Even if that thing has no greater affect on others than similar legal acts.

  5. #25
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    Default Re: Legality of foregrips on rifles and shotguns

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian D View Post
    It's not about safety. It's about jerk offs hopping out of thier cars when they see a big buck and using the vehicle as a stabalizer to take a shot.

    They DO NOT want you discharging your weapon near the road, parking area, or any other place random people could be milling around. So they wrote the law that a loaded gun can not be touching the car.


    There were tons of people doing stupid things hundreds and thousands of years ago. The issue is that it is almost impossible to get laws taken off the books, so as new things come and go there are only more laws.

    There are many laws on the books that are uninforced, redicoulous, and no longer valid.

    You can thank the war of drugs for most of your issues. It has introduced a school of thought that the only way you can stop something from happening is to criminalize it. Even if that thing has no greater affect on others than similar legal acts.
    Most of the road proximity issue has already been addressed by:

    34 Pa CS § 2504. Shooting on or across highways.
    (a) General rule.--It is unlawful for any person to shoot at
    any game or wildlife while it is on a public highway or on a
    highway open to use or used by the public or to shoot across a
    public highway or a highway or roadway open to use or used by
    the public unless the line of fire is high enough above the
    elevation of the highway to preclude any danger to the users of
    the highway. It shall be unlawful for any person, after
    alighting from a motor vehicle being driven on or stopped on or
    along a public highway or road open to public travel, to shoot
    at any wild bird or wild animal while the person doing the
    shooting is within 25 yards of the traveled portion of the
    public highway or road open to public travel.
    and as already noted in post #15, the vehicle aspect is addressed by § 2503 "in or on ... any conveyance propelled by mechanical power".

    What Title 34 prohibitions are there against discharge "near ,,, parking area, or any other place random people could be milling around"?

    As to shooting off a vehicle it's unclear to me whether you can stabilize yourself on a stopped vehicle while holding the firearm totally out of vehicle contact having alighted from the vehicle (anyone with citations?). It may be covered under:

    § 2308. Unlawful devices and methods.
    (a) General rule.--Except as otherwise provided in this
    title, it is unlawful for any person to hunt or aid, abet,
    assist or conspire to hunt any game or wildlife through the use
    of:
    (7) A vehicle or conveyance of any kind or its
    attachment propelled by other than manpower.
    although some case law indicates that the intent of the above is use of a vehicle to 'pursue' game.

    Commonwealth v. Cook, Common Pleas Court of Warren County, Pennsylvania. 1989.



    In light of the foregoing, what purpose other than safety would you attribute to § 2503's "or against" proscription?
    Last edited by tl_3237; September 27th, 2013 at 04:04 PM.
    IANAL

  6. #26
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    Default Re: Legality of foregrips on rifles and shotguns

    Quote Originally Posted by RusskyDudesky View Post
    So I went to my local range today up in Peekskill, NY with my Ruger PC4 carbine to spend an hour or so sighting in my new scope and trying out the rifle with a new foregrip I attached to a barrel clamped tri rail adapter. One of the guys there who is a frequent shooter told be that foregrips are supposedly illegal and make my Ruger an "assault rifle". I'm pretty sure I read the SAFE Act correctly and in there it makes no mention of foregrips being illegal except on pistols. Also, the range only allows for loading of 5 rounds in the magazine even though state law says that a maximum of 10 rounds may be loaded at the range and 7 rounds everywhere else, so what was he harping on about that it's illegal? How are the laws in PA in regards to foregrips on rifles and shotguns? As far as I'm concerned, I didn't find any verbiage stating that a foregrip on a long gun makes it an "assault weapon". Nothing annoys me more than peopleb who don't mind their own business at the range and start lecturing me on what's legal and what's not when they themselves are not knowledgable of the state gun laws.
    You could have a foregrip on your foregrip in PA for all we care down here.

  7. #27
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    Oct 2008
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    Harrisburg area, Pennsylvania
    (Dauphin County)
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    Default Re: Legality of foregrips on rifles and shotguns

    Quote Originally Posted by Kabloosh View Post
    You could have a foregrip on your foregrip in PA for all we care down here.
    I am not a lawyer. Nothing I say or write is legal advice.

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