Senseless Murder Victims

[DemonOfTheFall]

Got into a bit of a nonsensical debate the other day with someone about gun control...most of the standard uneducated and naive nonsense, and my return points were ignored as usual. The main thing that blew my mind was that this girl's main point was "OMG the chances of you ever needing a gun to defend yourself are so slim, and you're more than likely going to kill yourself or someone innocent." I tried in vain to bring up Eve Carson (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Eve_Carson) as a prime example of how a 'normal' person (meaning not in a gang, not involved in questionable/illegal activities, not in a bad part of town) can so quickly be a victim of violent, senseless crime. Someone at the utter mercy of a criminal with no means to defend themselves. This girl was selected by the perpetrator to be murdered. There would be no bargaining.

I need more ammo. I'd like you all to pick your brains to think of some more examples in the news, or local (that don't have the news impact of a pretty young white girl getting shot) of senseless violence perpetrated by criminals on unarmed citizens.

Where begging didn't work.

Where talking didn't work.

Where acquiescing to demands didn't work.

Where there was only one option...to fight back...and the option wasn't there.

I find it frightening that so many seemingly intelligent, sensible people I seem to talk to seem willing to get down on their knees and be executed like a dog. To cower in the corner and wait for someone else to end their life. It shouldn't be surprising considering the genocides that have happened in history.

I'd like to stay away from the VTech/Columbine type incidents. These have been well documented and too quickly devolves into the "psychos with guns" bullsh#t.

[38SnubFan]

I use this simple fact when someone voices to me that they THINK the chances of having to use a gun in self-defense is "too slim".

There are at least 2 million defensive uses of firearms annually. This number DOES NOT include uses by the police, government, or military.

And, not including LEO and military, there are 80,000,000 lawful gun owners in the United States.

This means that the chances that I'll need to at least present the weapon are going to be 1:40, or even less.

While they're not "sure odds," they're certainly not comfortable odds, and I choose to be prepared.

This piece of information has put some "Shock and Awe" into a lot of people sitting "on the fence" about guns and sometimes changes their viewpoint.

Your mileage may vary.

Stay safe (and armed),
38SnubFan

[John7878]

that this girl's main point was "OMG the chances of you ever needing a gun to defend yourself are so slim, and you're more than likely going to kill yourself or someone innocent."

I like to use this example:

In March 1982, 25 years ago, the small town of Kennesaw – responding to a handgun ban in Morton Grove, Ill. – unanimously passed an ordinance requiring each head of household to own and maintain a gun. Since then, despite dire predictions of "Wild West" showdowns and increased violence and accidents, not a single resident has been involved in a fatal shooting – as a victim, attacker or defender.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/ar...TICLE_ID=55288

[Dredly]

How many examples do you want? These are just a few that I found in a matter of minutes. Does she go to the mall or attend church? I left out the school shootings on purpose as she can easily drop the "I don't go to school" argument. All of these are completely innocent people who were just in the wrong place at the wrong time but could have stopped massacres if they would have been armed and acted quickly

(3/31/08) - ― One man was killed and four others injured in a shooting in front of a church that was hosting a food service program for the homeless.

http://cbs5.com/crime/richmond.drive.by.2.687937.html

(2/2/08) CHICAGO, Illinois (CNN) -- A gunman who shot and killed five women in a clothing store at a suburban Chicago strip mall Saturday remains at large, police said.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/02/02/store.shooting/

(12/9/07) COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. -- Two church members were shot to death and three others were injured after a gunman opened fire outside the New Life Church in Colorado Springs as Sunday services were wrapping up.

(12/6/07) Gunman Kills Eight, Then Himself, at Omaha Shopping Mall

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,315342,00.html

(8/13/07)

EOSHO, Mo. (AP) — Prosecutors filed three murder charges Monday against a Micronesian man accused of opening fire in a church, killing three people and wounding five others during a service for a mostly Micronesian congregation.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/...shooting_N.htm
(2/12/07) 5 dead + shooter at Trolley Square Mall in Salt Lake City

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolley_Square_shooting

[Chainsaw]

As they say, violence is very, very rarely the answer, but when it is, it's the ONLY answer.

[XD40coyote]

Not a murder case, but a nicer neighborhood in Baltimore has this rapist running loose, attempted rape on first woman, 2nd woman the guy showed a gun and made her submit. Now the neighbors are all edgy, but the newspaper article says nothing about arming ones self at least in the home where MD at least allows it. The rapist followed the women to their homes, so ccw would have been better rather than just having a gun in the house, but MD is a bunch of pansies on the ccw issue.


Murder cases- way too many have occured where if the victim had been armed, they would still be alive- various cases of victims of serial killers, esp of women are best examples. These women lived in suburban, urban, and even some in rural areas. Not to mention alot of the guys dump the bodies off in very rural areas- what if you happened to stumble into them while they were doing so? What if it was your bit of land and you were just coming by to check on it, and here's this guy dumping a body?


Oh I just remembered a case in MD of a parking garage murder. It was in Towson at the Towsontown mall lot. Towson is a "good" area, but alot of lowlifes have been around for several years now so you have to be on the watch. Not sure of the details, but the man was at his car and these thugs shot him to death and I think stole the car. I guess it was a murder/carjacking deal. Made huge news for a while. VERY prime example why to carry, but then MD wants everyone dead except the criminals.

[762xIan]

It is a hard mentality to break through thats is for sure. I have tried on numerous occasions to debate rationally with anti's pretty much to no avail.

Some people just don't seem to understand, real life isn't what you see on TV, it aint lollipops and rainbows. You can't just wish all guns and crime away. EVIL does exist in the hearts of people, and the best thing to do is be prepared.

Steer her toward this site, lays out some info pretty simple and to the point. Lots of great posters and pictures also.

http://www.a-human-right.com/

From the site:



After reading the site, if they still don't get it...oh well, you tried.

[Willtallica]

Tell her that she needs gun because I'm coming after her with my bare hands.

In reality she's an irresponsible coward, and nobody should ever listen to a coward. In fact she should be slapped in the face for potentially subjecting us all to very bad harm. Anyone who's not a jerk off knows that the common successful criminal doesn't due to one's convenience await for the cops to be around before they commit a crime, and that they in fact will only commit a crime when the coast is clear.

I have a fire extinguisher, and I will probably never use it. Better to be one step ahead.

[fingers80002]

Try this one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lvV3gr_vinE

She watched her parents killed, because she couldn't have her weapon with her.
It was in her car, outside.

Remember, when seconds count, the cops are minutes away!!

[jcabin]

good woman