Township of Pine Preemption Violation?

**PocketGenius** · February 4th, 2013, 07:16 PM

I was looking through local codes and such and came upon this.

http://ecode360.com/9191354

§ 104-1. Rifles to be regulated.

A. No person shall, except in necessary defense of person or property, use air rifle of a caliber of .22 rimfire or greater within the Township of Pine, except as herein provided.

B. No person shall, except in necessary defense of person or property, fire or discharge any rifle of a caliber of .22 rimfire or greater within the Township of Pine, except as herein provided.

§ 104-2. Use delineated.

A. Rifles of a caliber of .22 rimfire or greater shall be deemed to be used within the terms of this chapter if they are loaded and carried by any person, regardless of whether or not the firearms have been, are being or are intended to be discharged.

B. The mere act of carrying firearms at any place other than an approved rifle range shall be sufficient under this chapter to include their use.

B. The mere act of carrying firearms at any place other than an approved rifle range shall be sufficient under this chapter to include their use.

Is this a preemption violation?

**Curmudgeon** · February 4th, 2013, 07:23 PM

If there is a violation, I'm not seeing it.

EDIT: Correction, see posts 5, 8, and 12 below.
.

**Statkowski** · February 4th, 2013, 07:46 PM

Curmudgeon is correct (as always?). What the municipality has done has been to take the term "no firearms discharge" and muddle it up with a plethora of excess verbiage.

On the bright side, they did make a self defense exemption for the discharge prohibition.

Nothing illegal here to see.

**PocketGenius** · February 4th, 2013, 07:54 PM

I guess I read the "use" clause as stating one couldn't have/carry a loaded rifle anywhere excepting the exceptions (?).

Also, the change of verbiage from "rifle" to "firearm."
I know that a pistol isn't a firearm in PA law, but this gives no definition and implies a distinction in my mind.

I don't even live in Pine, but I came across it and was curious.

Thanks for the responses.

**gnbrotz** · February 4th, 2013, 08:00 PM

Regulation of hunting is also preempted. I'm not familiar with the geography and population of this area, but it's possible that these regulations impact lawful hunters, which would be outside of their authority.

**twoifbysea** · February 4th, 2013, 08:19 PM

well, let me put it this way. it is made up of $300,000 to $2,000,000 homes. some of which are located on Treesdale country club. it used to be all farm land. people like that don't hunt.

**EandGWZ** · February 4th, 2013, 09:09 PM

So it is a summary offense to carry a rifle or air rifle .22 cal or greater? A 300 dollar fine for doing something legal?

**gnbrotz** · February 4th, 2013, 09:36 PM

Originally Posted by Curmudgeon

If there is a violation, I'm not seeing it.

Originally Posted by Statkowski

Curmudgeon is correct (as always?). What the municipality has done has been to take the term "no firearms discharge" and muddle it up with a plethora of excess verbiage.

On the bright side, they did make a self defense exemption for the discharge prohibition.

Nothing illegal here to see.

Rereading, I disagree. They deem "carrying" to be "using", which they have banned. They do not have the authority to ban carry, ONLY discharge.

**Justin** · February 4th, 2013, 09:55 PM

Originally Posted by gnbrotz

Rereading, I disagree. They deem "carrying" to be "using", which they have banned. They do not have the authority to ban carry, ONLY discharge.

Correct. The text that was posted is a violation of preemption.

**BlueTrooper** · February 4th, 2013, 10:03 PM

Originally Posted by PocketGenius

I guess I read the "use" clause as stating one couldn't have/carry a loaded rifle anywhere excepting the exceptions (?).

Also, the change of verbiage from "rifle" to "firearm."
I know that a pistol isn't a firearm in PA law, but this gives no definition and implies a distinction in my mind.

I don't even live in Pine, but I came across it and was curious.

Thanks for the responses.

Since when is a pistol not counted as a firearm?

18 Pa.C.S. § 6102: Definitions
"Firearm." Any pistol or revolver with a barrel length less than 15 inches, any shotgun with a barrel length less than 18 inches or any rifle with a barrel length less than 16 inches, or any pistol, revolver, rifle or shotgun with an overall length of less than 26 inches. The barrel length of a firearm shall be determined by measuring from the muzzle of the barrel to the face of the closed action, bolt or cylinder, whichever is applicable.

http://reference.pafoa.org/statutes/...2/definitions/