SD Ammo for my .45 ACP - debating between two of DoubleTap's rounds. Opinions?

[SouthPhilly]

Was looking at some new self-defense ammo, my HST's have been sitting for AWHILE in the mags. I hear great things about Double Tap, so I was looking at these two;

Caliber : .45ACP
Bullet : 185gr. Nosler JHP
Ballistics : 1225fps - 616 ft./lbs. - 5" 1911
"The fastest 185gr loading on the market! All in a package that is just shy of a +p rating!"

Caliber : .45ACP
Bullet : 230gr. Bonded Defense™ JHP
Ballistics : 1014fps/ 521 ft./lbs. - 5" 1911
"The fastest 230gr loading on the market! All in a package that is just shy of a +p rating!"

I mean, both of those numbers look sexy, especially vs Hydrashok's 397 pounds and 900fps.

Any opinions or personal experience? I've read guys arguing about jacket separation etc., but then saw tons of positive reviews

[FJRMarty]

Since we are theoretically going to shoot someone in a self-defense scenario, and as excited as you may be in that scenario, one would want to be, as much as possible, cool, calm, collected, and in control. I think these Double-Taps look like they would be a handful, at least the 185 gr., after the 1st shot. One might consider penetration / expansion compared to other SD rounds. I have not seen any gel results comparing Double-Tap to say, Speer Gold Dot or Silvertips.

My only experience is a friend bought me a box of 125gr 357 for my M13 K frame, but I think they are too hot to risk cracking the bbl, so I won't load them. 1650 fps, 750+ lb. ft. seems just too much for my K frame.

With what are you planning on shooting them? I'd say in an N frame they would be OK, not sure how aggressive you can get in an M&P or other semi-auto. Maybe someone with experience with Double-Tap will chime in.

[SouthPhilly]

Since we are theoretically going to shoot someone in a self-defense scenario, and as excited as you may be in that scenario, one would want to be, as much as possible, cool, calm, collected, and in control. I think these Double-Taps look like they would be a handful, at least the 185 gr., after the 1st shot. One might consider penetration / expansion compared to other SD rounds. I have not seen any gel results comparing Double-Tap to say, Speer Gold Dot or Silvertips.

My only experience is a friend bought me a box of 125gr 357 for my M13 K frame, but I think they are too hot to risk cracking the bbl, so I won't load them. 1650 fps, 750+ lb. ft. seems just too much for my K frame.

With what are you planning on shooting them? I'd say in an N frame they would be OK, not sure how aggressive you can get in an M&P or other semi-auto. Maybe someone with experience with Double-Tap will chime in.

Was going to put them through my XDm .45. I handle the glock 20 with full power rounds very well for follow up shots and follow up placement, so I was thinking it shouldn't be an issue. I'm just not sure how well the gun itself will take to the pressure. They're claiming it's still shy of a +P round?

[IK_biker]

616 ft./lbs.

//snip

Learn the lingo first.
It aint ft/lbs.

Other than that, I have no experience with .45 ammo, and no particular suggestions on the subject.

[reverserboy]

In .45ACP I would go with a 230gr. Buffalo Bore also makes a 230gr +p loading you may want to consider.

[pyld]

I've carried Gold Dot 230g in my XD-45. Never felt wanting for better ammo for whatever that's worth.

With that said, I also subscribe to the theory that shot placement is a far more accurate barometer of success with regard to stopping a threat when it comes to modern hollowpoint ammo. YMMV.

[SouthPhilly]

//snip

Learn the lingo first.
It aint ft/lbs.

Other than that, I have no experience with .45 ammo, and no particular suggestions on the subject.

...really? You've got 14 posts in 2.25 years, you average 6 posts a year and you make a post like this? First off, learn that if ANYTHING about that is incorrect, it should just be ft-lbs without the slash, because the term when speaking about muzzle energy from the round, IS foot-pounds.

Other than that you have "no experience with .45 ammo" nor suggestions on the subject? Then why even comment? Just to be trolling the forum, making INCORRECT corrections? Some gun enthusiast you are, no experience with .45 ammo as a whole, I wouldn't trust ANYTHING you say in regards to firearms then.

As far as learning the lingo, blow me because that's copy and pasted from DoubleTap's actual website. So, go e-mail them, plus Speer, Hornady and Federal, quite possibly the largest self-defense ammo companies in the entire industry and tell them they're all wrong.

Thanks!!

http://www.speer-ammo.com/ballistics...x?loadNo=23966 "foot pounds"
http://www.hornady.com/assets/files/...nterSpread.pdf "Energy(Ft/Lb)"
http://www.federalpremium.com/produc...un.aspx?id=354 "Energy in Ft/Lbs"

[IK_biker]

SouthPhilly,

Perhaps you should consider giving a subject some thought before posting immature replies like your last one.

Foot-pounds is correct Also denoted as "ft.lb" or "ft.lbf".

You spoke of "ft/lbs", which is not a measure of energy nor does it equate foot-pounds.
Unlike you, I know what I'm talking about.

The reason I posted was to show you your mistake and give you an opportunity to learn from it.
I am not sure you are capable of learning, since in turn you hastily produced links to documents which were quoting an incorrect unit of measure as well.

At least, I tried.....

[SouthPhilly]

SouthPhilly,

Perhaps you should consider giving a subject some thought before posting immature replies like your last one.

Foot-pounds is correct Also denoted as "ft.lb" or "ft.lbf".

You spoke of "ft/lbs", which is not a measure of energy nor does it equate foot-pounds.
Unlike you, I know what I'm talking about.

The reason I posted was to show you your mistake and give you an opportunity to learn from it.
I am not sure you are capable of learning, since in turn you hastily produced links to documents which were quoting an incorrect unit of measure as well.

At least, I tried.....

Look, you can try and sound as formal and educated as you'd like behind your keyboard, but your not fooling anybody. The way you go about delivering your posts, your clearly trying to deliberately sound educated. The reason you posted was to show me my mistake and to learn from it? First off, it's not MY mistake, considering it's copy and pasted from the company's website. Second, if you go through various manufactures websites to find their ballistics results, many of them are titled 'Ft/Lbs' in the energy column.

My thread was asking for an opinion/advice on the posted question, not an ignorantly written "it ain't" this or that and especially the, "learn the lingo" part. Your response of, "Learn the lingo first", grammatically implies before even asking my question, I should go learn the proper terminology. Sorry, but your response basically say implies I'm some rookie and should go learn the proper terminology.

Hate to break it to you, but your non-contributing, forum lurking status here and the 7 people that repped me with comments that are insulting toward you, seem to agree with me.

Any time your in the Philadelphia area, I'd be more than willing to have any highly-active user of Pafoa come mediate a range trip and I'll put up $200 per target at 20 yard grouping and out shoot you all day long.

[MicroMonkey]

I never fired those rounds either, but would be curious about it also. I also have the mindset that I would like a more manageable round for self defence than something really hot. Less recoil means better target acquisition, but thats just for me. I would like to shoot these rounds tho. maybe something in the 185gr area