NY and PA

[PhilB]

A good friend and gun enthusiast lives in NY. He has an interesting collection of handguns. Obviously, he has a NY pistol permit and all his guns are recorded on his permit. We're trying to figure out how to get together for a "range day" so we can play with each others toys.

I can't enter NY with any of my guns, because I don't have a NY pistol permit, and NY and PA have no reciprocity. My friend can't take possession of my guns at the border, because they are not recorded on his permit.

The alternative we have discussed is this: I can meet him at the state line and he can give me his guns for me to transport in my car. (I have an LTCF and he is not a prohibited person.) We can have our fun and when he goes home, I give his guns back to him at the state line.

The only hitch that I can envision is if someone decides we are engaged in suspicious activity at the state line or, during a police stop, his guns fail to show up on a PA "registry".

Anything I'm missing here? I'm not asking for legal advice.

--Phil

[Mancolt]

The only hitch that I can envision is if someone decides we are engaged in suspicious activity at the state line or, during a police stop, his guns fail to show up on a PA "registry".

--Phil

I'm not an expert, but I think the only "registry" they run it against is for stolen property. So as long as the guns aren't flagged as stolen, I think you'd be fine. A possibly simpler solution would be to have him get a non-resident permit from a state that does have reciprocity with PA, like Arizona or Utah. I believe Arizona is the easiest and cheapest to get at this time though, any NRA class counts as the necessary training. It wouldn't be immediate though, but it would be worth it if you plan on doing this again in the future.

[PaGunner]

I would say your best bet is to have your friend come to PA for anything firearm related. When transporting any firearms make sure you are in compliance with 18 U.S.C. § 926A of the FOPA, assuming you don't have a LTCF. I spoke with a buddy of mine who is a state trooper and he told me that when they run firearms in their database it comes back as either stolen or not stolen, information about the owner or who/where the gun is registered does not appear.

If he is traveling and in compliance with 18 U.S.C. § 926A and gets pulled over in NY he SHOULD be ok, but I am not sure about NY law on transporting in a car. Federal law should trump state law but ask NJ about that one (look up the case of Brian Aitken).

Either way if I were you I would stay out of NY with firearms period.

Check out 926A on the link below.
http://www.nraila.org/federalfirearms.htm

Or if you have a lot of time on your hands...
http://uscode.house.gov/download/pls/18C44.txt

[Doughdaddy]

A possibly simpler solution would be to have him get a non-resident permit from a state that does have reciprocity with PA, like Arizona or Utah.

Why not just get a PA non resident permit? There is a list on this site of counties that are friendly to NR permits in PA and which are not. That is the easiest and fastest way to do it. Then he can come and go into PA at will.


ETA: check this http://www.pafoa.org/counties?county...esidentLTCFs=1

[donm]

He should be fine in PA if he goes directly to/from the range. You probably could borrow his guns since you have a LTCF and federal law allows that for "sporting purposes." Also note that you can carry in a vehicle in PA with a license/permit from any state, even NY (though it may depend on what kind of a NY permit he has).

[HiredGoon]

Best solution, though probably not practical... have your friend move to PA permanently.

And he won't even have to "register" his guns when he moves to PA

[Mancolt]

Why not just get a PA non resident permit? There is a list on this site of counties that are friendly to NR permits in PA and which are not. That is the easiest and fastest way to do it. Then he can come and go into PA at will.


ETA: check this http://www.pafoa.org/counties?county...esidentLTCFs=1

Honestly, I never even considered a PA non-resident LTCF. I didn't even know there was one...obviously I've never had a reason to need one. But that probably is the easiest, although an Arizona would allow him to come and go into PA at will just the same as a PA non-res would AFAIK.

[knight0334]

Your NY friend CANNOT loan you the guns for such purposes. General target shooting is not recognized as a "sporting purpose" to be exempt of federal law.

Since he has a NY permit, it would be valid within a vehicle in PA.

What you two need to do is: your friend from NY drives to PA with his guns, you both meet at a range within PA, you then exchange "gun time" with each other's firearms on the range. Since the respective gun owners would be present there wouldn't be a loan or transfer.

[tl_3237]

I would say your best bet is to have your friend come to PA for anything firearm related. When transporting any firearms make sure you are in compliance with 18 U.S.C. § 926A of the FOPA, assuming you don't have a LTCF. I spoke with a buddy of mine who is a state trooper and he told me that when they run firearms in their database it comes back as either stolen or not stolen, information about the owner or who/where the gun is registered does not appear.

If he is traveling and in compliance with 18 U.S.C. § 926A and gets pulled over in NY he SHOULD be ok, but I am not sure about NY law on transporting in a car. Federal law should trump state law but ask NJ about that one (look up the case of Brian Aitken).

Either way if I were you I would stay out of NY with firearms period.

Check out 926A on the link below.
http://www.nraila.org/federalfirearms.htm

Or if you have a lot of time on your hands...
http://uscode.house.gov/download/pls/18C44.txt

What you're proposing (FOPA on a trip between contiguous states) is fraught with risk:
http://forum.pafoa.org/concealed-ope...ly-report.html

[donm]

Your NY friend CANNOT loan you the guns for such purposes. General target shooting is not recognized as a "sporting purpose" to be exempt of federal law.

I'm curious how you came to this conclusion. I've seen it discussed here in the context of borrowing a gun to carry, but don't recall anything about target shooting.