Selling Longguns

[luckyned7]

Hello,
I hope to reduce my collection to "currently in-use" longarms. How do CYA myself without making trips to a FFL dealer? I ask for a copy of their PA driver license? I've sold a few (off my back) years ago at PA gun shows. How do I know they are not still registered to me? I asked the PSP a few years ago for a list that I'm accountable for. <--naive? "They don't do that." I was told. I guess I'm asking how I keep myself safe while I sell off my stuff.

[thundrr1]

You might want to browse the stickies. Like this thread...

http://forum.pafoa.org/general-2/414...nsfers-pa.html

[Xringshooter]

First off, there is no "registration" of guns in PA. What people call a registration is a database of guns sold/transferred through FFL's. I am not going to get into how police use this database incorrectly, that is a whole other discussion. A FTF sale of a long arm is not "registered" anywhere.

Now. back to your question. You can do whatever you and the buyer agree to. It could be a bill of sale (there is one here on the forum you can download), it could be you just seeing his PA driver license to insure he is a PA resident. Again you can do whatever you deem enough to prove you are no longer the owner of the gun.

Here is what PA Chapter 61, Title 18, section 6111(c) says:

Duty of other persons. --Any person who is not a licensed importer, manufacturer, or dealer and who desires to sell or transfer a firearm to another unlicensed person shall do so only upon the place of business of a licensed importer, manufacturer, dealer or county sheriff's office, the latter of whom shall follow the procedures set forth in this section as if he were the seller of the firearm. The provisions of this section shall not apply to transfers between spouses or to transfers between a parent and child or to transfers between a grandparent and grandchild.

Then you have to read 6111(f)(2)

The provisions contained in subsections (a) and (c) shall only apply to pistols or revolvers with a barrel length of less than 15 inches, any shotgun with a barrel length of less than 18 inches, any rifle with a barrel length of less than 16 inches or any firearm with an overall length of less than 26 inches.

In your case this all boils down to mean that you (a PA resident) can sell, face to face, no FFL needed, a standard long arm to any other PA resident who is of legal age (18 for long arms) and is not prohibited from owning firearms, and no paperwork is required.

[Emptymag]

You could use a bill of sale. It's not perfect, but may make you feel better.

Here's a PDF file of one I like and have used. There are others available by Googling:

[chivvalry]

You can also, if you so desire, ask to see an LTCF so that you have some certainty that the person you are selling to is a "good guy". I don't advocate for this as not all "good guys" have a LTCF but it is an option for you.

[Hawk]

...or any firearm with an overall length of less than 22 inches.

22 inches? I thought the minimum OAL was 26? Where am I confused?

[Xringshooter]

22 inches? I thought the minimum OAL was 26? Where am I confused?

Edited, I was confused also by the copy of the UFA that I downloaded from the PA Legislature site. The correct OAL is 26", not 22" as I erroneously put in my answer(s). I am sorry to have confused anyone.

[Hawk]

Reread that section, basically it is saying that you cannot sell a handgun, short barreled rifle or short barreled shotgun to a person without going through a FFL.

Yes, I've always understood this.

Also bear in mind that these are PA regulations. You still must meet Federal Regs also. Also think Thompson Contender with a 16" barrel - it is a handgun with a barrel length of over 15 inches but its overall length is less than 22 inches so to sell one you have to go through a FFL.

What difference does the OAL make? If it's categorized as a "handgun" or "SBR" or "SBS" it will always have to go through a FFL regardless of the OAL length, right? So, where does the 22" come into play to make any difference? I guess I'm just a bit dense today. And since the OP was talking about transferring long guns, I'm not sure where 22" comes into play, hence my 26" statement.

[BimmerJon]

It's 26" not 22"

[Pkspawn]

) can sell, face to face, no FFL needed, a standard long arm to any other PA resident who is of legal age (18 for long arms) and is not prohibited from owning firearms, and no paperwork is required.

Is this based on the honor system? Who would get in trouble if, I legally sell a long gun to someone who I believed was not prohibited and they turn out to be prohibited?

Or does it all fall on the purchaser who should have known they were not allowed to have/buy a gun?