Pennsylvania Firearm Owners Association
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  1. #1
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    Default 2 part q: (1) carry at work question, (2) universal carry permit?

    I do an unarmed security job some nights. It's basically the only time I don't carry aside from school since I am not certified to do the job armed yet and don't want to break any laws or rules or get fired. Also, I don't want to end up in a scuffle where I can't even use it and have the bad guy end up getting it off me.

    But I was just wondering where that would lie in the law? I know you can basically carry concealed at work as long as they don't have a weapons policy, but would that get hairy in a line of work where you might be more inclined to need to use it? I live in the safe part of town and walking for 8 hours straight iwb is uncomfortable anyways, but just curious.

    part (2) of this is that is I was offered to go along with a group for tour doing some side jobs and security. Is there a way to be certified to carry as security in multiple states while traveling? I've seen people in the music industry do it but no clue if they were actual traveling officers or what.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: 2 part q: (1) carry at work question, (2) universal carry permit?

    Ok, im not going to comment on the laws because im not a lawyer and don't know everything. But since you said you don't want to get fired for having a gun when your not allowed to, I think you just answered your own question in regards to carry at work. Its a big risk and one I don't advise taking. Most people on this site carry 24/7 when NOT at work. Its just a fact of life for almost all of us.

    Btw, welcome to the forum.
    Practicing free speech outside of the designated free speech zones.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: 2 part q: (1) carry at work question, (2) universal carry permit?

    If you are employed as security, you definitely need to be certified under ACT 235 in order to carry on duty. http://www.lethalweapons.state.pa.us...g_program/7611

    On the second question: I am not aware of Security Officers being able to carry in multiple States.
    NRA Certified Instructor Pistol & Shotgun

  4. #4
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    Default Re: 2 part q: (1) carry at work question, (2) universal carry permit?

    +1 for the Act 235 if you are in the security business.

    As for the nationwide reciprocity, this is only in place for law enforcement or retired law enforcement officers. Otherwise you would have to be licensed/permitted to carry in each state, which would be VERY expensive and impossible for some states.

    Of course IANAL and this is my take from reading the laws regarding reciprocity.
    Criminals LOVE gun control. It gives them a safe work enviroment.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: 2 part q: (1) carry at work question, (2) universal carry permit?

    I would think company rules and policy is you can't carry at work, as well as laws pertaining to 235. So don't.

    Armed security personel, provided the company is a recognized security company, have many regulations to deal with when bodyguards are traveling with the client. It's different state to state and therefore a complicated situation that shouldn't be attempted by those not deeply familar with how it's done.

    Armed civilians and armed guards live with a different set of rules and those rules rarely jive with each other.

    My advice is don't carry at work at all until the company provides training and permission. Your breaking company rules and several laws otherwise.
    When the SHTF......be the fan.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: 2 part q: (1) carry at work question, (2) universal carry permit?

    You do not need to be Act 235 to exercise your rights to carry a concealed weapon for personal protection. ONLY if you are going to use it in the course of your daily job would you need the cert

    In your jobtitle it states "Unarmed Security"... so you are unarmed.

    There is no such thing as a "universal carry permit", however cops can generally carry wherever they want in the US
    The first vehicles normally on the scene of a crime are ambulances and police cruisers. If you are armed you have a chance to decide who gets transported in which vehicle, if you are not armed then that decision is made for you.

    Be prepared, because someone else already is and no one knows their intent except them.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: 2 part q: (1) carry at work question, (2) universal carry permit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dredly View Post
    There is no such thing as a "universal carry permit", however cops can generally carry wherever they want in the US
    That would be the Law Enforcement Officer Safety Act (LEOSA, HR218 2004), which requires certification and training, and is only open to those that are defined as law enforcement, get to carry a gun on the job, and have arrest powers. FOP has a cheatsheet on LEOSA here. That would allow you to carry in any and all US Territories. Unfortunately, unarmed security generally meets none of the requirements for LEOSA.

    Generally speaking, folks that do armed security gigs for a touring group use reciprocity to their advantage. Know your route, then get permits or licenses that are valid in those regions. Common ones that you'll easily get some help for on this board are Florida, Utah, and Arizona, since they require training and therefore have higher reciprocity than a PA LTCF. Handgunlaw.us has a decent reciprocity indication system, wherein you select the license you have, and then it builds a map on where your combined permits are honored or not honored. Keep in mind that even if you have reciprocity with a state other than the issuing authority, you are still bound by the regulations of the state in which you are present, and they are not uniform between States. For example, NJ has a possession ban on all hollowpoint ammunition, and Ohio requires you to announce to law enforcement, when stopped, that you are armed. Some states allow open carry, some forbid it. Some states allow it, but the weapon must be unloaded. Handgunlaw.us can help you out there too.

    And, as always, if one has a question, one can always ask.
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  8. #8
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    Default Re: 2 part q: (1) carry at work question, (2) universal carry permit?

    Thanks for the quick responses. As I mentioned before I wouldn't carry even if I was allowed to for personal protection just because of the possibility of the gun getting taken in a scuffle, but I was just curious.

    And in a nut shell to be armed security for touring you need multiple permits or to be an officer of the law?

    I'll be getting the act 235 as soon as I'm done with regular college classes. My father got it years ago and got a lot out of the classes so I'm eager to, even just to have it.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: 2 part q: (1) carry at work question, (2) universal carry permit?

    There are companies that provide armed security for those who
    seek it, from coast to coast, and overseas. If you desire a job
    in this field, then contact one of these firms.

    google: armed private security, are other such keywords.

    Good luck.
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  10. #10
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    Default Re: 2 part q: (1) carry at work question, (2) universal carry permit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dredly View Post
    You do not need to be Act 235 to exercise your rights to carry a concealed weapon for personal protection. ONLY if you are going to use it in the course of your daily job would you need the cert

    In your jobtitle it states "Unarmed Security"... so you are unarmed.
    Thats how I understood it. I carried most days while I was "Unarmed Security". I usually carried in a jacket pocket or cargo pocket. I wasn't worried about losing my job. The moment I thought my life was in danger, the job wouldn't be that important anyway.

    As I read the ACT235, it says those that carry as a part of the job, that wouldn't apply to you as unarmed.
    Adams County Sport Handgunners Association - President

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