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Thread: Police confront OCer
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December 27th, 2007, 12:33 PM #51
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December 27th, 2007, 12:39 PM #52Grand Member
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Re: Police confront OCer
This is precisely why I have a problem with the the way these two particular LEO's handled the situation. They DID know the OP was not there to engage in criminal enterprise precisely because of the patrol cruisers in the parking lot. Most criminals are dumb but they aren't completely witless.
Frankly, I don't find the fact that LEO's sometimes "stretch" the truth a bit in order to determine intent. IMO it's no different than the way prosecutors and defense attorney's ask "calculated" questions of witnesses in trials.
However, IMO, the "perfect" LEO response would have been:
"Sir, I see you're openly carrying a firearm. Are you aware of the risks regarding weapon retention"?
To which I personally would have replied:
"Yes I am . But I find it uncomfortable to dine while wearing a coat".
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December 27th, 2007, 12:44 PM #53
Re: Police confront OCer
I think you're right about these cops being decent cops and I don't have a crystal ball either but if you gave them any reasonable answer to that question other than "to shoot up the place," I suspect they would have been satisfied. The answer you were thinking of would seem to have been perfectly OK.
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December 27th, 2007, 12:45 PM #54
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December 27th, 2007, 12:49 PM #55
Re: Police confront OCer
Me too. From our account of this incident their motive was personal rather than professional. Their job as police officers didn't make them obligated to ask these personal questions.
I know some here disagree but I can only surmise they are more tolerant of police fishing than I am. It's kind of similar to the DUI checkpoint argument...
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December 27th, 2007, 12:50 PM #56
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December 27th, 2007, 12:50 PM #57Grand Member
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December 27th, 2007, 01:03 PM #58Banned
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Re: Police confront OCer
Clearly my analogy of stopping someone before getting in a car was missed' if driving a car was as unusual as seeing a common citizen openly carry and a car was known as a killing machine; the cop WOULD STOP AND INQUIRE.
Frankly all who say it wouldn't affect them at tall aren't being truthful; a plain clothed citizen carrying is so unusual you for damn sure would look twice and wonder. That is human nature, it's the reason racism can never go away; anyone that is different, in any way, is treated different.
I dont think there's any difference between a casual friendly conversation from a cop when he encounters the extremely rare open carry as being screened at the airport before boarding. I dont think you guys are being honest with yourselves, you cant see the forest for the trees. You are so into carry that you think it should be so common as to make no difference when you, one in maybe 5,000 or more, shows up with a gun strapped to your side. YOU STICK OUT LIKE A FREAKING SORE THUMB!!!! PEOPLE ARE GOING TO LOOK AND COPS WILL MORTE LIKELY ASK A FEW QUESTIONS. I'M GLAD THE DO; at least as glad as getting on a plane with a little better hope of not being used as part of a missile.
Cops feel best when they are the only ones with a gun; that's natural and you're expecting way too much for it not to be. Especially as bad as society has become.
This is no doubt going to be a 20 pager and I give up.
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December 27th, 2007, 01:15 PM #59
Re: Police confront OCer
That's a good post by the OP. Even though the LEO's were being nosy I am glad it turned out ok and they didn't cop a huge attitude.
"Do not take life too seriously. You will never get out of it alive." - Elbert Hubbard
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December 27th, 2007, 01:16 PM #60
Re: Police confront OCer
Not at all.....for the same reasons that have been shared on the forum time and time again - Criminals typically don't tote their firearms in a High Noon retention holster hooked to a Wilderness Instructors’ Belt.
Rational people do not typically go into businesses and hold up the joint at gunpoint. I would bet on the stereotype that Pennsylvania’s licensed citizens are typically rational people. I don't find OC'ing as alarming...
....HOWEVER.....
Speaking of stereotyping and the notion that licensed citizens are rational people - I WOULD be put on edge if someone entered the diner with what appeared to be a firearm in a Mexican Carry manner. And don't give me "yeah but IWB holster..." or "Clipdraw...." - those are typically still carried in the 2-4 O'clock position. Mexican Carry is typically in line with the belt buckle. And how many people do you know are gonna OC with Thunderwear??!!
Stereotype? Yup! I PERSONALLY do not consider Mexican Carry as smart or rational - and if any of our PAFOA community carries in this manner....I'd be on alert in your presence. That method of carry is NOT typical of the LTCF community.
Your thoughts??Gary in Pennsylvania
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“No One Can Make You Feel Inferior Without Your Consent.” Eleanor Roosevelt
“Argue For Your Limitations……And Sure Enough, They’re Yours.” Messiah's Handbook
“The unexamined life is not worth living.” Socrates 399BC
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