LTCF Application Question

**gbrown221** · April 3rd, 2011, 10:07 AM

Originally Posted by bob2055

About a year ago I applied for and was denied a LTCF by the Philly PD because of a 10 year old arrest. All the charges from this arrest were "dropped" or "withdrawn" by the DA's Office. There was no deal, I didn't plead to a lesser change or anything like that. All charges were withdrawn by the DA. Due to this 10 year old arrest, the Philly PD denied my LTCF due to the character and reputation clause in state law. I don't have the denial letter anymore because I moved and must have lost it. I am in the process of having this arrest expunged from my record. After the expungement goes through and they notify me that the record has been expunged, I intend to apply again. In the mean time I applied for and received a LTCF from another state which has a written reciprocity agreement with PA. So my question is this, when I reapply do I have to tell the Philly on the application which is question 40 on the application, which states do you have a license from another state? Or is this question on the application for people who are applying for a non-resident LTCF?

Another example of Philadelphia using non conviction data in the determination of the issuance of a LTCF. Once again Philadelphia willfully and willingly violating the PA Criminal History Information Act that clearly states you cannot use non conviction data, not guilty, and/or summary offenses yet Philadelphia still does. The only way to put a stop to this will be a class action lawsuit IMO.

**PAS&W** · April 3rd, 2011, 10:25 PM

Originally Posted by bob2055

About a year ago I applied for and was denied a LTCF by the Philly PD because of a 10 year old arrest. All the charges from this arrest were "dropped" or "withdrawn" by the DA's Office.

I intend to apply again. In the mean time I applied for and received a LTCF from another state which has a written reciprocity agreement with PA.

Did you get a NON-resident or a Resident License from the other State ?

If possible I suggest you MOVE to another county.

P.S. - don't EVER lie on a Govt. form - that 's a CRIME known as filing a
false Instrument and CAN land you in JAIL.

.

**bob2055** · April 3rd, 2011, 11:32 PM

Originally Posted by PAS&W

Did you get a NON-resident or a Resident License from the other State ?

If possible I suggest you MOVE to another county.

P.S. - don't EVER lie on a Govt. form - that 's a CRIME known as filing a
false Instrument and CAN land you in JAIL.

.

Non Resident LTCF from a state which has a written reciprocity agreement with PA. I know Philly won't recognize it because of their recently passed illegal ordinance, but better to have something than nothing at all, in case I have run in with the PPD. Which I don't intend to do. I prefer and always carry concealed (I'm not opposed to open carry, I feel it's a personal choice).

I understand fully that not being truthful on a goverment form can get a person in trouble. The question on the application is this:

40. OTHER THAN PENNSYLVANIA, DO YOU POSSESS A CURRENT LICENSE, PERMIT, OR SIMILAR DOCUMENT TO CARRY A FIREARM
ISSUED FROM ANOTHER STATE? IF YES, ATTACH A PHOTOCOPY OF THE DOCUMENT TO THIS FORM.

I was just thinking that this question was geared toward a non resident PA LTCF. However, the question is strainght forward with no exceptions. I guess what I'm trying to say is that I don't trust the PPD with this information. I feel it's none of their business if I have an out of state LTCF.

If something were to happen (I hope it never does) like I was legally defending myself, the PPD would assume from the jump that I was wrong and pull my permit (if I get one after my expungement). Then they would know that I have out of state LTCF and notify them too so they can have that LTCF pulled too. Then I'd be left with nothing.

Here's what I think I'm going to do. After my expungement goes through, I'm going to apply to the PPD for a LTCF. I'm going to answer question 40 truthfully and provide a copy of my out of state LTCF. Then if they approve me and I obtain a PA LTCF, I'm going to apply for another out of state LTCF from a state which has a written reciprocity agreement with PA so I can have it as a back up which they won't know about it. Afterall the question doesn't say "Do you, in the future, intend to obtain a LTCF from another state?

Sounds legal to me.

**IronSight** · April 3rd, 2011, 11:37 PM

Originally Posted by bob2055

If something were to happen (I hope it never does) like I was legally defending myself, the PPD would assume from the jump that I was wrong and pull my permit (if I get one after my expungement). Then they would know that I have out of state LTCF and notify them too so they can have that LTCF pulled too. Then I'd be left with nothing.

Easier said than done on their part. Florida for example isn't going to just "pull" your license because Philly wants them too, they'll only do so if Florida statute mandates/permits them to do so.

**bob2055** · April 3rd, 2011, 11:53 PM

Originally Posted by IronSight

Easier said than done on their part. Florida for example isn't going to just "pull" your license because Philly wants them too, they'll only do so if Florida statute mandates/permits them to do so.

I understand that. However, if they know I have LTCF from another state and like I said something were to happen, even if the PPD couldn't get them to revoke it because of what you said, the PPD would surley confiscate my out of state LTCF so I wouldn't have it. So if I obtain one after the fact that they don't know about they can't take it because they won't know about it.

**bob2055** · April 4th, 2011, 12:12 AM

Originally Posted by bob2055

I understand that. However, if they know I have LTCF from another state and like I said something were to happen, even if the PPD couldn't get them to revoke it because of what you said, the PPD would surley confiscate my out of state LTCF so I wouldn't have it. So if I obtain one after the fact that they don't know about they can't take it because they won't know about it.

I just want to say that I'm NOT trying to anything illegal. But the PPD makes it so hard, and makes you go through all sort of illegal BS to obtain a LTCF. They abuse their discretion.

I don't want to get into chapter and verse of what happened 10 years ago but here it is in a nut shell. I understand the 10 year old charges were serious. But when my attorney explained the entire situation to the ADA, and I also has witnesses to coraborate my side of what actually happened, the ADA made the call to tell the judge that he wanted to withdrawl all charges. The judge called my attorney and the ADA to the bench. Where my attorney explained everything and told the judge I had witnesses to back up my side of what happened, the accuser had nothing but his word, the judge agreeded with the ADA and granted all charges to be withdrawn or in legal speak Nolle Prossed.

I should have had this expunged years ago. But I didn't know it would come back to haunt me. But it did.

Of course the arrest didn't stop me from buying a Glock about a month ago. But it did stop me from obtaining a LTCF from the Philly PD.