In a situation!

[countryboy172]

Today at the Giant Eagle by my home I was put into a situation. I was doing the self check out, minding my own business when a man waiting behind me started to yell at a lady and her child. I thought this was wrong no one should ever yell at someone else's child especially as loud as he was. I was startled by the yell. I quickly snapped my head and body around with my hand on my gun not under my shirt but over top of it just in case. Now im not a small person by any means about 6'4" 260 lbs and this guy was a small guy about 5'9" 160 lbs. So I calmly told the guy not to yell at her kid it was inappropriate to yell that loud at the kid, he then told me to mind my business that it was between him and this lady. I told him that if he didn't stop yelling at the child and lady it would be my problem. He then proceeded to get into my face and start on me. we exchanged words and he started to reach under his jacket on his belt, I didn't know what to other than show my gun and tell him it wasn't a good idea.
And believe me im not one of those people who go out looking for fights or reasons to use their guns.

Now after that being said I was wondering if it was the right thing to do?
Has anyone else been in a situation where you think someone else might draw a gun on you?
Would anyone have done the same thing i did?

Did pay for my groceries and left.

[junyo]

My $0.02. Once it got to the point of him reaching under his coat, I'm not showing, I'm filling my hands.

That said, I probably wouldn't have gotten into it if the guy didn't look like he was an imminent physical threat to the woman or kid. Not criticizing. But while getting yelled at isn't fun, it's not a threat to life and limb. The problem with inserting yourself into that situation at that moment is you're in a bad part of the escalation curve. Whatever their beef was, and it doesn't sound like you know what it was, he now has to look like a jerk in front of more people, which is automatically making him angrier. And while assaulting the kid might not have been in the plan, getting in your face allows him to take out that anger and save his pride by making someone back down. When you didn't, his options started closing off, either push harder or look like an ass; and the situation gets more and more unpredictable based on how far he'll push, and how rational he is. Unpredictable is bad. Add to that the fact that once you've shown your weapon, you're imminently predictable, you've shown your hand. I think you present your weapon real early and give the guy an out before he's really commited or right before you start shooting; achieve either a complete diffusion of the situation or complete suprise on the part of the assaillant.

Now you've got to get out of the store and to the car, while keeping track of this guy, and any friends he might have outside, and they know you're packing and even where it is. The incident averted just doesn't seem like it was worth the subsequent risk.

[LorDiego01]

Of course, one had to have been there to make give an educated opinion, but given my current knowledge of the law, I would not have intervened.

I might have stood around looking, making sure he didnt attack the child or the woman, but I wouldnt have said a word to the man.

If he got really heated, you might have wanted to put a call to 911 and tell them whats going on.

I make it a personal point never to interfere in a fight, unless I know all the circumstances that led to that.

I made that mistake many years ago, which led to a whole bar brawl. My roomate told me some dude slapped her (!!!!) and punched her brother on top of it.

Of course, when it was all was said and done, when my I had the dude's blood on my fists and a fat lip of my own to boot, that she found it appropriate to share with me that she had initially thrown a rock at that dude's car, leaving a nice dent on it.

Funny fact, a few months later I ran into the same dude and his friends at another dive bar, he recognized me, we bought each other several shots of Tequila, we talked about what a bitch my roomate was, how much each other's punches had hurt, we shook hands and called it a night. Its amazing the power of alcohol to make friends or enemies very quickly!

All in all, I think you were completely wrong in interfering, flashing your gun, and possibly making a bad situation worse. At the same time, props for sticking up for the woman and the child.

[CKeen]

In a few ways, I have to agree. Showing your hand too soon is not always the best policy.

That being said, however, in that situation, I'd probably do the same as you. If my tour as an MP in Iraq taught me anything, it was to gain the upper hand and controll the situation thoroughly and as quickly as possible. "Neutralize the Threat" as it were.

I would also try to be as carefull as possible, though because it sounds as if you were dealing with a typical, "the world owes me something and I got big brass ones" kind of guy. This type is not prepared for a confrontation, opting instead for a weasly back-shot.

All said, I give you koodos for doing the right thing.

[kx90]

You're lucky the cops don't show up because he called 911 and said a man threatened him by showing their gun to them in a menancingly manner.

I'd have kept out of it until he threatened them. At that point he would've been staring down the end of a barrel .40+ in diameter. At the same time I would've kept myself between him and his target(s) and dialed 911.

[Holleta]

I agree with Diego and his advice....stay as far removed as possible unless absolutely necessary. Call the Police/911 if needed. Great story by the way Diego...LOL...that is beautiful!!

Of course, one had to have been there to make give an educated opinion, but given my current knowledge of the law, I would not have intervened.

I might have stood around looking, making sure he didnt attack the child or the woman, but I wouldnt have said a word to the man.

If he got really heated, you might have wanted to put a call to 911 and tell them whats going on.

I make it a personal point never to interfere in a fight, unless I know all the circumstances that led to that.

I made that mistake many years ago, which led to a whole bar brawl. My roomate told me some dude slapped her (!!!!) and punched her brother on top of it.

Of course, when it was all was said and done, when my I had the dude's blood on my fists and a fat lip of my own to boot, that she found it appropriate to share with me that she had initially thrown a rock at that dude's car, leaving a nice dent on it.

Funny fact, a few months later I ran into the same dude and his friends at another dive bar, he recognized me, we bought each other several shots of Tequila, we talked about what a bitch my roomate was, how much each other's punches had hurt, we shook hands and called it a night. Its amazing the power of alcohol to make friends or enemies very quickly!

All in all, I think you were completely wrong in interfering, flashing your gun, and possibly making a bad situation worse. At the same time, props for sticking up for the woman and the child.

[dnar]

Yeah, countryboy172 I agree with a lot of the points that everybody stated. I've seen guys like that many times making a scene in public just as you described. They have big mouths and probably have very little dignity, that's why they act the way they do. And you probably wounded his pride by stepping in and defending the kid.

Man it seems like you don't have much luck at that Giant Eagle! That lady calling you a name the other day, and now this!

Rand

[TonyF]

........ I calmly told the guy not to yell at her kid it was inappropriate to yell that loud at the kid, he then told me to mind my business that it was between him and this lady. I told him that if he didn't stop yelling at the child and lady it would be my problem.

At this point you escalated. Now, on impulse, I probably would have said / done the same thing but you have to be careful that someone may have been within ear shot. If it got ugly, statements like that could be used against you.

He then proceeded to get into my face and start on me. we exchanged words and he started to reach under his jacket on his belt, I didn't know what to other than show my gun and tell him it wasn't a good idea.

Flashing your pistol was not a good idea.

For *another perspective*, I started this thread a few months ago.

http://www.pafoa.org/forum/concealed...rspective.html

[Lougotzz]

Everyone is going to give you advice on what you should have done and what not to do. I am not going to do that I am going to make a few points and you decide in your own mind what is the best way to handle a situation like this next time. It might be the same way it might be different. All situations are different and only you can make that decision.


1. My gun is for me and my family. I am not in the police business.
2. I will only pull my gun if my life is in danger and if I pull it 99.99% I am shooting.
3. If I didnt pull my gun (with my thinking I shot the guy) I would not be here to tell you about it.
4. Try to retreat as much as possible.
5. Don't get involved with other peoples crap. This would go to number 1. You dont know who they are. What history they have together. Who is the bad guy. Who is the good guy.
6. When I carry my gun it makes me timid, More polite and less confrentational.


In this day and age people have to be responsible for thier own safety. This is a shall issue state.

[Pukindog]

My question is "What would you have done if you were not carrying heat?"
Many people have found big trouble for brandishing a gun when there was no need for it.
Stay out of other people's business.
Jeff