Chester men facing federal gun raps

[reels18]

Published: Wednesday, April 1, 2009

http://www.delcotimes.com/articles/2...1628496367.txt


By CINDY SCHARR
cscharr@delcotimes.com

PHILADELPHIA — Two Chester men are each facing up to 15 years in a federal prison after pleading guilty to the straw purchase of six firearms.

Kyle Saunders, 21, and Jeffery Williams, 49, pleaded guilty to conspiracy and two counts of false statements to a federally licensed firearms dealer before U.S. District Judge Juan R. Sanchez in federal court.

Williams straw-purchased six handguns for Saunders in 2006, when Saunders was under the age of 21 and could not legally make the purchase, according to court documents.

The owner of an Upper Darby gun shop contacted ATF agents after receiving a call from Williams saying he wanted to buy three Highpoint pistols that were ordered over the Internet. The storeowner told the ATF that two months earlier, Williams had purchased three other Highpoint pistols from him. Those weapons were also purchased over the Internet, court documents indicate.

With the approval of the ATF, the gun shop owner contacted Williams and told him he could pickup the three pistols on Dec. 12 around 4 p.m. At about 4 p.m., surveillance officers saw Williams and Saunders enter the gun shop.

Williams completed the paperwork and was given three handguns. The two men put the guns inside of a U.S. Postal Service mailing box then stashed the box in a leather backpack carried by Saunders.

ATF agents followed the two men to a house on West Seventh Street in Chester. Saunders went into the house and Williams drove off. He was stopped a short distance away. ATF agents searched the house on West Seventh Street, with approval from the homeowner, and found the backpack and four of the six firearms, court documents indicate.

On Dec. 12, Williams provided investigators a written statement admitting he bought the six firearms for Saunders because “he couldn’t because he was a minor or had a criminal record or something.”

After entering guilty pleas, both men were allowed to remain free on bail pending sentencing. Williams is scheduled for sentencing on July 30; Saunders on July 8.

The case was prosecuted by Assistant U.S. Attorney Ewald Zittlau and investigated by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.
Comments

[tlgpa]

The owner of an Upper Darby gun shop contacted ATF agents after receiving a call from Williams saying he wanted to buy three Highpoint pistols that were ordered over the Internet. The storeowner told the ATF that two months earlier, Williams had purchased three other Highpoint pistols from him.

I don't get this part. Wonder what prompted the gun shop to contact ATF? Hope something more than just ordering guns on the internet 2 months apart.

[reels18]

How many gun shops are left in Upper Darby?

[LittleRedToyota]

holy crap.

actually enforce existing straw purchase laws instead of calling for more gun control.

what a novel concept...and it seems to have actually worked!

whodathunkit?

[/sarcasm]

[LittleRedToyota]

I don't get this part. Wonder what prompted the gun shop to contact ATF? Hope something more than just ordering guns on the internet 2 months apart.

well, it sounds like they ordered multiple copies of the same cheap and popular with bad guys and not generally valued by collectors handguns on two separate occasions. that alone would be enough to make you go "hmmm?" imho.

and we don't know what the rest of the circumstances were.

two guys involved...one of whom was under 21 at the time. perhaps when they picked up the first order, the under age one was asking relevant questions/all excited about the guns while the older guy was just filling out the paperwork or something like that.

[Whiskey Delta]

Stolen guns and straw purchases are/were big business in Chester.

Couple years ago, a woman who had made three straw purchases of handguns that were used in homicides was assassinated while she was sitting outside her child's school on 10th street in the West End. The murderers found out the cops had approached her with the evidence and that she could tie them to the crime, so the got her while she was waiting for her daughter to come out of school.

She had been encouraged and supported by a Chester Police officer who was also assassinated while on the job several weeks later. He was ambushed blocks from where she was killed.

I picked him up on the squad, and it was a sad event for all.

The lowlife pieces of shit didn't realize that the guns didnt have to come back to THEM to be used as evidence. Apparently they'd gun someone down and drop the gun ala "The God Father".

When they found out that the CID had traced three crime guns to HER, and that she was going to flip in exchange for getting off, they killed her and the cop that had spoken with her.

They set the cop up by using an acquaintance who called him to offer information and told him to have all cops in the sector to pull out and meet with him alone, which he did.

He was gunned down and never knew what hit him.

There was no help near him when he was killed. All the city ambulances were tied up when he was killed, I responded as a mutual aid from a neighboring township but the time delay didn't matter.

Investigators ultimately and rather quickly pieced it all together. He had told detectives of his actions before his death, and they finished it, arresting three within a couple weeks after a manhunt.

[adymond]

holy crap.

actually enforce existing straw purchase laws instead of calling for more gun control.

what a novel concept...and it seems to have actually worked!

whodathunkit?

[/sarcasm]

I was pretty shocked about that too. My god are the laws actually being enforced. What is going on?

well, it sounds like they ordered multiple copies of the same cheap and popular with bad guys and not generally valued by collectors handguns on two separate occasions. that alone would be enough to make you go "hmmm?" imho.

and we don't know what the rest of the circumstances were.

two guys involved...one of whom was under 21 at the time. perhaps when they picked up the first order, the under age one was asking relevant questions/all excited about the guns while the older guy was just filling out the paperwork or something like that.

It might be enough to make you go hmm, but I don't know that it is enough to call the ATF, execute a stop and conduct a search.

[LittleRedToyota]

It might be enough to make you go hmm, but I don't know that it is enough to call the ATF, execute a stop and conduct a search.

there are two issues:

1. the store owner calling the ATF. regarding that issue, that is why i said we do not know the rest of circumstances. but, if i were a store owner, two orders for several hi-points only months apart would be enough to make me take note of the rest of the cirucumstances. if we were talking about collectible guns or something, it would be different, but who collects hi-points? if the buyers did not in any other way appear curious to me, i would not likely call the ATF, but if there were any other circumstances that also sent up a red flag, i prolly would. i would at least ask them why they were buying so many hi-points and then base my response on their answer.

also, an unfortunate reality is that the store owner has to cover his own butt. given how rabidly the ATF goes after some gun stores, i can't really fault the guy for doing that.

2. the ATF stopping and searching. again, we don't know the totality of the circumstances. but, the ATF did just follow them for awhile. the ATF did not immediately stop them. so, there may have been something else they observed to further their suspicions. also, the article says the homeowner gave them permission to search the house. so, no rights violation on that search. and, they may not have even detained williams until after the search turned up evidence.

all in all, i just think there is not enough information in the article (and, of course, you never know how accuracte the information that is there is) to really judge. but, and perhaps i differ from many PAFOAers on this, but i do think two orders for mutiple hi-points only months apart is at least a bit suspicous...again, they just aren't really collectible guns as far as i know and they do tend to be popular with criminals as they are cheap. if the guns in question were, for example, 1911s, i would probably not have the same initial reaction.

[reverserboy]

The ATF recieved a detailed tip from an FFL complete with paperwork....RAS

Agents knew about purchase & followed actors from FFL to residence....more RAS/probable cause.

They witnessed straw buyer & new owner with guns go seperate ways....a crime.

The agents made arrests after searching with concent of propery owner. I'm thinking getting a warrent at this point would have been no problem...just more time consuming. I'm not a lawyer but I would say the agents did everything right.

[son of the revolution]

Multiple handgun sales are required to be reported to the ATF National Tracing Center




Inspections of Firearms Dealers by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives

Report Number I-2004-005
July 2004








The ATF Firearms Tracing Program

In 1994, the ATF consolidated its tracing activities at the National Tracing Center (NTC) in Falling Waters, West Virginia. The NTC traces the purchase histories of "crime guns" recovered by federal, state, local, and international LEAs.29 The ATF defines a "crime gun" as any firearm that is "illegally possessed, used in a crime, or suspected by law enforcement officials" of having been used during the commission of a crime. Crime gun tracing data can identify potential firearms trafficking and unlawful business practices by FFLs. The ATF has the following tracing-based indicators of firearms trafficking:


Short Time-to-Crime. The recovery of a crime gun within 2 to 3 years after its initial purchase is considered a short time-to-crime and a significant trafficking indicator. According to the ATF, about one-third of crime guns were recovered within 3 years of their first retail purchase. The short time from retail sale to use in a crime "suggests illegal diversion or criminal intent associated with the retail purchase from the FFL." 30

Multiple Sales of Handguns. According to the ATF, 20 percent of all handguns traced in 2000 had been originally purchased as part of a multiple handgun sale. FFLs are required to report multiple handgun sales to the NTC.