Self-defense debated in NY shooting

[Zef_66]

Original Link to Article

Self-defense debated in shooting
Line between business and home could be one issue in case of burglary suspect shot by store owner


By PAUL NELSON, Staff writer
Click byline for more stories by writer.
First published: Tuesday, October 16, 2007

SCHENECTADY -- As investigators probe the weekend shooting of a robbery suspect in the city, legal experts say several key issues might determine whether the store owner fired in self-defense.

John Phillip Sayers, 21, was shot by Donald Khemraj early Sunday morning after Sayers broke into Khemraj's family business on Albany Street, police said.

Khemraj, 59, and his son Roger Khemraj, 34, confronted Sayers inside Funn Electronics just before 6 a.m. Sunday.

Roger Khemraj said Sayers was armed with a pipe wrench and told Khemraj he had a gun, but Khemraj said he never saw a weapon.

Police found a pipe wrench at the scene, city police spokesman Brian Kilcullen confirmed Monday, but no second gun has been recovered.

Sayers' family has not yet retained an attorney.

On Monday, Schenectady County District Attorney Robert Carney and Capital Region attorneys said self-defense arguments can sometimes be difficult to wade through.

Speaking in general terms, attorney Stephen X. Kouray and Mark Caruso, a Schenectady County public defender, said the question that might roil any self-defense theory is whether the business is an extension of the home.

The Khemraj family lives above the store. "You might see an issue of where his dwelling starts and ends," Kouray said.

"What's critical is the physical layout of that building," Kouray said. If Khemraj was outside and could have retreated from Sayers, "he had no right to shoot him."

Kouray, Caruso and Carney agreed the law is clear: Residents can use deadly physical force inside their homes, but lose that right if they can safely retreat from danger.

"The law allows for self-defense, it doesn't allow for vigilantism," Carney said.

He said Monday evening that the case had been referred to his office and was being handled by Assistant District Attorney Bill Sanderson.

The district attorney noted that the deadly physical force rule also applies to business owners, but was a moot point in the shooting since he believed that the structure doubles as both a house and store. "It appears that it qualifies as a dwelling as much as it does a business," Carney added.

Roger Khemraj said his father fired at least one shotgun blast at Sayers only after the man jumped through the front door in a bid to escape.

If the case goes to trial, Sayers' lawyer may face an uphill battle in the minds of a jury and the court of public opinion, Kouray said.

"Your home is your castle, that's always the law," he said. "It's really hard to convince a jury that it's not justified."

Police said they found Sayers sitting in front of the store and didn't realize he had been shot until he collapsed.

Sayers remained hospitalized at Albany Medical Center Hospital Monday. He is charged with burglary and criminal mischief.

Monday afternoon, Kathy Sayers said she visited her grandson in the hospital, where he is in fair condition and in need of more surgery. He was wounded in the left arm and left side of his body, she said.

She said she and her mother, Anne Bagley, who reared John Sayers, saw him for about 15 minutes.

"He's in rough shape and totally messed up," Kathy Sayers said.

Nelson can be reached at 454-5347 or by e-mail at pnelson@timesunion.com.

[markheck1]

Original Link to Article

Self-defense debated in shooting
Line between business and home could be one issue in case of burglary suspect shot by store owner


By PAUL NELSON, Staff writer
Click byline for more stories by writer.
First published: Tuesday, October 16, 2007

SCHENECTADY -- As investigators probe the weekend shooting of a robbery suspect in the city, legal experts say several key issues might determine whether the store owner fired in self-defense.

John Phillip Sayers, 21, was shot by Donald Khemraj early Sunday morning after Sayers broke into Khemraj's family business on Albany Street, police said.

Khemraj, 59, and his son Roger Khemraj, 34, confronted Sayers inside Funn Electronics just before 6 a.m. Sunday.

Roger Khemraj said Sayers was armed with a pipe wrench and told Khemraj he had a gun, but Khemraj said he never saw a weapon.

Police found a pipe wrench at the scene, city police spokesman Brian Kilcullen confirmed Monday, but no second gun has been recovered.

Sayers' family has not yet retained an attorney.

On Monday, Schenectady County District Attorney Robert Carney and Capital Region attorneys said self-defense arguments can sometimes be difficult to wade through.

Speaking in general terms, attorney Stephen X. Kouray and Mark Caruso, a Schenectady County public defender, said the question that might roil any self-defense theory is whether the business is an extension of the home.

The Khemraj family lives above the store. "You might see an issue of where his dwelling starts and ends," Kouray said.

"What's critical is the physical layout of that building," Kouray said. If Khemraj was outside and could have retreated from Sayers, "he had no right to shoot him."

Kouray, Caruso and Carney agreed the law is clear: Residents can use deadly physical force inside their homes, but lose that right if they can safely retreat from danger.

"The law allows for self-defense, it doesn't allow for vigilantism," Carney said.

He said Monday evening that the case had been referred to his office and was being handled by Assistant District Attorney Bill Sanderson.

The district attorney noted that the deadly physical force rule also applies to business owners, but was a moot point in the shooting since he believed that the structure doubles as both a house and store. "It appears that it qualifies as a dwelling as much as it does a business," Carney added.

Roger Khemraj said his father fired at least one shotgun blast at Sayers only after the man jumped through the front door in a bid to escape.

If the case goes to trial, Sayers' lawyer may face an uphill battle in the minds of a jury and the court of public opinion, Kouray said.

"Your home is your castle, that's always the law," he said. "It's really hard to convince a jury that it's not justified."

Police said they found Sayers sitting in front of the store and didn't realize he had been shot until he collapsed.

Sayers remained hospitalized at Albany Medical Center Hospital Monday. He is charged with burglary and criminal mischief.

Monday afternoon, Kathy Sayers said she visited her grandson in the hospital, where he is in fair condition and in need of more surgery. He was wounded in the left arm and left side of his body, she said.

She said she and her mother, Anne Bagley, who reared John Sayers, saw him for about 15 minutes.

"He's in rough shape and totally messed up," Kathy Sayers said.

Nelson can be reached at 454-5347 or by e-mail at pnelson@timesunion.com.

That's a bit of a grey area there, if he truly shot him while he was trying to escape, he could be in trouble....unless he was trying to take something with him....

[Zef_66]

That's a bit of a grey area there, if he truly shot him while he was trying to escape, he could be in trouble....unless he was trying to take something with him....

All depends on the exact wording of NY laws. Just thought it was interesting though....

[markheck1]

Yeah, definitely

[bradjc72]

it will be interesting to see how this pans out in the end