Founders quotes, check your sources

[jpkotor]

So it looks like the threat of the AWB is waning a bit, but this isn't over and it's still a critical time to be able to have well informed debates with those not as into the 2A as many of us.

We all know DC v Heller should settle the whole individual vs collective right debate (for now), whether or not anti's agree. But many on the other side still question what the purpose of this individual right is...

I've noticed in the last few months that a lot of founders quotes have been circulating around here, on FB, Reddit, etc. They seem to put the final nail in the coffin of the questions that have been the focus of the gun debate for decades.

The strongest reason for people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government. -Thomas Jefferson

Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the American people's liberty teeth and keystone under independence. The church, the plow, the prairie wagon, and citizen's firearms are indelibly related. From the hour the Pilgrims landed, to the present day, events, occurrences, and tendencies prove that to insure peace, security and happiness, the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable. -George Washington

Seems pretty definitive right? So why are the motives still in question?

I suggest this line of thinking when preparing your armamentarium of 2A defenses: If a quote sounds too good to be true, it probably is. Take for example both of the quotes above, neither of which can be definitively attributed to their supposed speakers.

Try to stay away from false quotes so you don't get caught with your pants down. There is plenty of good evidence that supports the 2A so we should avoid things that can be so easily discredited.

Both the SAF and Guncite have a collection of fake quotes to avoid. The SAF also has a couple fake anti-gun quotes.

I stumbled upon these a couple months ago I got curious about where/when the above Jefferson quote was said. Turned out it wasn't. If in doubt, Google it.

Edit: Or any 2A/gun related quote for that matter, not just founders.

[JenniferG]

If you check your quotes with Snopes, take it with a grain of salt. They are agenda driven despite their objections to that accusation. They are liberals with a Google search engine, that's all.

[flabbydan]

"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional development." is another one. It's not in any of Freud's writings. (At least that's what I learned on the interwebs.)

[DClan]

Quote:Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the American people's liberty teeth and keystone under independence. The church, the plow, the prairie wagon, and citizen's firearms are indelibly related. From the hour the Pilgrims landed, to the present day, events, occurrences, and tendencies prove that to insure peace, security and happiness, the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable.*-George Washington

" the prairie wagon"? Really? Ole George is supposed to have used this term well over 50 years before it was called that? Some may argue that they had these wagons before he died, yes and no. During George's time they developed the Conestoga wagon, a covered wagon named after the Conestoga valley it was developed to traverse. The prairie wagon, aka " the Prairie Schooner " was a lighter version developed to carry settlers across the plains during western expansion. Some of these quotes give away their falsehood by incorrectly included facts. You just gotta look and listen. I am sampling the qoute used by the op, and I am not attributing it to the op, the op said it was false, I'm just elaborating.
Thank you jpkotor.

[libra8]

"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass." is a quote by Isoroku Yamamoto, Commander-in-Chief of the Imperial Japanese Navy.

Not so much. Unless you ask Chuck Woolery.

Sorry, just re read the title. Last time I checked Yamamoto wasn't a founder. DOH.

[jpkotor]

"You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass." is a quote by Isoroku Yamamoto, Commander-in-Chief of the Imperial Japanese Navy.

Not so much. Unless you ask Chuck Woolery.

Damn, I liked that one! haha

Let's all let that one slide

[flabbydan]

Sorry, just re read the title. Last time I checked Yamamoto wasn't a founder. DOH.

Are you sure? I think I read on the internet that he signed the Declaration right below John Hancock.

[jpkotor]

Sorry, just re read the title. Last time I checked Yamamoto wasn't a founder. DOH.

Still applicable, the title reflects what influenced me to make the thread, but even I strayed away by linking to the anti-gun quotes, which include Hitler and Sarah Brady, neither of which founded the country, IIRC, YMMV, IMHO, IANAL

[BSH]

Any USSC decision can be reversed, keep that in mind.

I prefer to avoid rhetoric and focus on facts. Would a gun law affect homicide rates? If you say yes, show evidence. National Academy of Science finds no link between gun control laws and homicide rates. (there's a full PDF on their site - google it)

[TaePo]

Any USSC decision can be reversed, keep that in mind.

I prefer to avoid rhetoric and focus on facts. Would a gun law affect homicide rates? If you say yes, show evidence. National Academy of Science finds no link between gun control laws and homicide rates. (there's a full PDF on their site - google it)

Bad argument point.

1) What if we could prove there is a positive effect?
2) The Second Amendment is about not regulating self defense which is considered a natural response to a threat whether from a defined criminal or tyrant of politics. In other words, you can not regulate people to go against their own natures or instincts for survival.

I like to quote from founding documents (Declaration of Independence and Constitution) and the Federalist/Anti-Federalist Papers. Hamilton's #84 is especially eye opening as he explains why he is against enumerating rights in the Constitution. By doing so, he provides insight to the meaning of individual rights themselves.