Started teaching my 10 month old gun safety

[ddefazio]

Last night I had my gun out and was cleaning it. My son happlily crawled over to where I had my gun taken apart. He showed alot of interest in what I was doing so I let him stay there and watch. After I was finished with it I put the gun down(unloaded) and waited to see how he would react. Of course seeing the beautiful gun laying there he went for a grab. I immediately said not now. he looked up at me and then while he had his eyes locked on mine began to inch his wandering little fingers toward my XDM till I said not now. He then began to cry and I understood his pain. We continued to do this for the rest of the night. This morning before I left for work I put the XDm on the floor by his crib and pulled him out to play on the floor and he would not even go close to it. Hopefully he will just look at this as a boundry and not as something to be scared of. I know it is best to keep it locked up but I carry it so it doesn't see the safe too often. I wanted this to be an extra precautionary not that I would ever trust him around my gun.

[Whiskey Delta]

Last night I had my gun out and was cleaning it. My son happlily crawled over to where I had my gun taken apart. He showed alot of interest in what I was doing so I let him stay there and watch. After I was finished with it I put the gun down(unloaded) and waited to see how he would react. Of course seeing the beautiful gun laying there he went for a grab. I immediately said not now. he looked up at me and then while he had his eyes locked on mine began to inch his wandering little fingers toward my XDM till I said not now. He then began to cry and I understood his pain. We continued to do this for the rest of the night. This morning before I left for work I put the XDm on the floor by his crib and pulled him out to play on the floor and he would not even go close to it. Hopefully he will just look at this as a boundry and not as something to be scared of. I know it is best to keep it locked up but I carry it so it doesn't see the safe too often. I wanted this to be an extra precautionary not that I would ever trust him around my gun.

So, you put something in his field of view, make him interested in it and make it something that he wanted and you then remove it so that he cries? And you did this more than once so that he cries repeatedly?

Christ, tell me you are joking.


That is commonly called "Teasing" since your son doesn't have the capacity to understand danger, and doesn't understand what "no" means at this point in his development.

You have taught him NOTHING at this point except that one of the few people in his young world that he should be able to count on is teasing him and making him cry. You did not teach him gun safety, you taught him that it was futile to try and see whatever it was that you had, since he LEARNED that you would take something he was interested in away from him. Bad move, dude.

Cruel is what your actions were.



Things that babies want that aren't good for baby would be best left until baby has gone to sleep. Start teaching your child about comfort and safety first, that means not intentionally making him cry and seeing you as someone who hurts him.

I really see the need for some parenting classes and a session reading up on child development..seriously.

[RaisedByWolves]

This thread makes me cringe.......


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[Bmarshall91]

i have to agree with whiskey delta. I'm not going to be as harsh as him though.... lol


Your son doesn't know the difference between yes and no yet. I have an 11 month old son who crawls up the steps every chance he gets if i'm not looking. I say no, and he continues to do it... so i put a gate up. him repeatedly ignoring my NO command leads me to believe he doesn't understand that word yet. So using my sofahistikated mind here... if my 11 month old doesn't understand no, your 10 month old most certainly does not know the WORDS not right now.

you really haven't taught him anything. sorry bra.

[ddefazio]

I actually work with my son alot on what he can touch and can't. this is not teasing him it is working with him and parenting him. My son does know that when I tell him no or not now that means not to touch. There is a good book on this that you might want to check out that is called to Train up a Child written by Michael Pearl and his wife. It talks alot about working with your kids from an early age (infantcy) what is right and what is wrong. If you do not agree with this type of parenting it is just different than the normal Child centered parenting. I am not saying my way is better and your way is wrong. I am just trying a different approach...

[Kaos]

i have to agree with whiskey delta. I'm not going to be as harsh as him though.... lol


Your son doesn't know the difference between yes and no yet. I have an 11 month old son who crawls up the steps every chance he gets if i'm not looking. I say no, and he continues to do it... so i put a gate up. him repeatedly ignoring my NO command leads me to believe he doesn't understand that word yet. So using my sofahistikated mind here... if my 11 month old doesn't understand no, your 10 month old most certainly does not know the WORDS not right now.

you really haven't taught him anything. sorry bra.

But how does blocking it simply solve the equation, it doesnt.

You have to show children (repeatedly) what "no" means...why do you think "no" is so many children's first word? Repetition is generally the easiest way to get a young child to learn something.

[Whiskey Delta]

I actually work with my son alot on what he can touch and can't. this is not teasing him it is working with him and parenting him. My son does know that when I tell him no or not now that means not to touch. There is a good book on this that you might want to check out that is called to Train up a Child written by Michael Pearl and his wife. It talks alot about working with your kids from an early age (infantcy) what is right and what is wrong. If you do not agree with this type of parenting it is just different than the normal Child centered parenting. I am not saying my way is better and your way is wrong. I am just trying a different approach...

I think there is a vast difference between "Training" and "Raising". Training creates obedience eventually, but at what cost? There is a fine line between discipline and belligerent dominance of an infant's mind. Obedience is only one facet of overall child development, and it appears that the Amish model has placed quite a value on it, and let me tell you that there is a cost involved.

The book you quote is a model of the Amish child rearing. Although the authors are not Amish, they have taken their book wholesale from the Amish.

There seems to be a direct parallel between horse training and child training in that book.

Pavlov demonstrated many of the techniques in "Raising up a Child" on his dogs.

Most Amish kids are quiet and well behaved (in public) the question is, do you really want to model a technique that is based on children who won't go beyond the 7th grade, and will only have passing acquaintance with modern values, modern societal norms and values.

When you say "Working With" your son, I gotta tell you it sounds like you are house training a dog, rather than a child. Tell me, does the book advise on using a crate to potty train him?

I don't care what 'source' you quote, taking an 11 month old and repeatedly giving and taking away is giving mixed messages, and is a lousy technique unless you are seeking to create a repressed child who views his father with suspicion at best and hostility at worse.The belief that you are somehow instilling an elevated concept like gun safety in a child who is still preverbal is ludicrous in the Nth degree.

I am really not sure how the love affair with the Amish method ever started. The Amish have more internal problems than many know, but living around them and having contacts within them has taken the scales from my eyes.

They have huge amounts of depression and psychosis within their community. I am not saying it is a result of their child rearing, but they don't place a very high value on their child's welfare in comparison to our society.

Don't be impressed with them having quiet children. Their children are often quiet and well behaved because they have learned, much as the livestock have, that their owner has a strong and willful hand.

No Thanks.

My kids are reasonably well behaved as they are. I have seen plenty of quiet kids in the ER, stoic through pain and suffering. Children become inured to pain because of frequent exposure to it.

Hardly the model of child rearing I would favor.

Just like the internet, books should be read with a critical eye. Being published does not confer expertise. Remember there are plenty of books espousing the value of communism, gun-control and genocide.

[Kaos]

I think that might be taking a bit too far. By today's standards spanking is abusive. I got my ass kicked from paddling and I turned out fine....better than if I had not been paddled. It shows there can be repercussions.

I think the point you may be trying to make is that the style itself could use some tweaking.

My daughter is 5, and I think instilling a fear of guns or a NO reflex is a bad thing myself.

What I do is when she gets curious...we look TOGETHER at the guns. They aren't anything to be feared. But we also go over the rules of safety, with my amendment "do not touch unless daddy is with you" I keep them locked up, but I think that this age gets me a better response because there is comprehension.

If the give/take was with food or a valid toy...then I would agree to the level that you are.

I think the point whiskey is making is that you aren't teaching your 10 month old gun safety....you're teaching him gun fear.

[djturnz]

I'm gonna have disagree with the OP on this one. Look up "Albert and the White Rats" for an pretty much exact example of what you did. You are teaching him fear of an inanimate object.

As a child gets older, and you can reason with them, that is the time to start talking about gun safety. All you have done is teach him that the gun he saw is bad. Will you do this with every gun you own?

Plus, how will you "untrain" him when he gets older and you want him to learn to shoot? It will already be engrained in his brain that the gun is bad, but he won't remember why.

I understand what you think you did, but I think you went about it the wrong way. At that age, he doesn't need to know to stay away from guns, that's your job, dad.

[ddefazio]

Albert and the White Rat was something different than what I was doing I believe. They were using fear to cause Albert to react to the rat. When my son was going to move toward the gun I did not try to scare him only used the words not now. I do this when we are on the couch together and he reaches for my remote or my cell phone. The words "not now" do not invoke fear in my son but rather I can't have this now. I don't think that my son is going to have some complex about TV remotes or Cell phones or electrical outlets because I tell him to not go near it right now. I think that the kids that do not have boundries in their homes and can grab and take whatever is in front of them is much more worse to the developement of the child. I sometimes wonder if we have gotten crazy with the whole baby proofing generation that we have become. You may disagree with me but that is the blessing of being able to freely discuss our methods or approaches with each other. I have friends that have padded up, locked up secured up everthing in their houses and I have watched their kids not know what to do when they start to recieve the slightest amount of freedom. Today instead of teaching our kids and spending time with them to show them what their boundries are we let them stay locked up in their padded bubbles playing video games or using the TV to teach our babies life lessons through sesame street. Maybe we should get on the floor with our kids and show them that we care by investing with them. If you want to say that me "working with my son sounds like I treat him like a dog then feel free to feel that way. The fact is that I Love my wife and my son more than anything in this world and I am proud to say that and do not need to feel like they have become burdens in my life. I am not Amish nor do i promote their beliefs in parenting but I do believe that I should "train" up my child. I believe this because my Bible says this in Proverbs 22:6 Train up a child in the way he should go, even when he is old he will not depart from it. I hope that you know that I am only sharing what I have seen fruitful with my child. I don't live by avarages of large numbers except in insurance. My son is one of the most vocal happy guys you would ever meet and he is not afraid of to many things just knows his boundries.