US gun control States lead the way in extending open-carry gun laws

[PAMedic=F|A=]

States lead the way in extending open-carry gun laws
While Barack Obama seeks to tighten gun controls nationally, at state level the movement to allow people to carry their weapons openly is gaining ground


Barack Obama’s executive action last week to expand the definition of gun dealers who must perform background checks elicited loud outrage from conservatives, as Republican presidential contenders warn that Obama wants to take all Americans’ guns away. So far, the response is only rhetorical.

But in the states, a quieter gun rights movement is gaining ground as lawmakers propose bills to pass new, even broader laws that allow gun owners to carry their weapons openly.

On Tuesday in Florida, state lawmakers gathered to start their 2016 session, and will soon consider two gun bills: one to allow 1.5 million Floridians with concealed-carry permits to carry their firearms openly, the other to allow guns on college campuses.

Despite the gun control movement’s momentum in recent years to pass many new restrictive laws, today only Florida and four other states – California, Illinois, New York and South Carolina – prohibit open carry. The other 45 allow it to varying degrees.

Even in the most open of open-carry states, gun rights advocates are scratching out new territory. Alabama, for example, has been gun-friendly since its inception. Gunpowder is baked right into the state constitution: “Every citizen has a fundamental right to bear arms in defense of himself or herself and the state.”

When Alabama’s state legislature reconvenes in February, it will consider a bill put forward by Republican representative Mack Butler, of Rainbow City, designed to allow students at universities to carry guns at school. In Alabama the age requirement to purchase a handgun is 18, so Butler’s bill would open up the possibility of freshmen walking to class armed.

“I hope to eliminate every gun-free zone I possibly can,” Butler told the Yellowhammer News a week ago.

Adam Winkler, a law professor at UCLA and author of Gunfight: The Battle over the Right to Bear Arms in America, said the gun rights strategy purports to turn back the national clock to a time when Americans lived closer to the land, defended themselves from harm, lived more independently – and carried six-shooters on their hips wherever they strode.


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It’s an appeal to romance. The problem, Winkler said, is that it’s false.

“Frontier towns had more restrictive gun laws,” he said. “When you rode into town you checked your guns with the marshal, and you could pick them up again later when you left town.”

The famous shootout at the OK Corral actually started when the local lawmen, including Wyatt Earp, tried to enforce Tombstone’s gun ban. There would be no carrying, open or otherwise.

So why the push for college campuses?

“That’s where the young people are,” Winkler said. They are forming ideas about what’s acceptable in society and what’s not. But more than that, he said, “It’s a sign of the success of the gun rights advocates. There is little left for them to win. The campus is one of the few contested battlegrounds left.”

The force that may eventually stop that sort of push – for more guns, everywhere, carried openly – may turn out to be other gun owners. “There is a debate now between concealed-carry and open-carry groups,” said David Helton, an optometrist in Atmore, Alabama, who carries guns for hunting and self-defense. “The concealed-carry people say open carry makes you a target. The open-carry people say it deters crime.”

On 1 January, Texas adopted open carry, in a victory for gun rights advocates. But the change has opened an unexpected schism between the two types of gun owners there. The law affects guns on public property, but private property holders can make their own rules. Businesses like restaurants and hotels don’t want their customers to feel threatened by local gunslingers, so they have started putting up signs: “No guns allowed.”

So suddenly the concealed-carry gun owners enjoy less freedom than before. And they’re angry.

“Places that were mum or fine on concealed carry and now in an over pc backlash has excluded decades long CC in some of the most popular corporate chains,” a gun owner posted on TexasCHLforum.com, a site for firearm enthusiasts. “And many other mom and pops who would rather not the instagram photo freaks clicking pics in front of their menu’s so I guess congrats to us, we cut off our nose despite our face.”

That sort of internecine frustration will fade, according to the strategy described by Winkler, as the population grows more accustomed to guns. Once people stop feeling afraid, the “no guns” signs will come down.

“This is about normalizing guns,” he said.

“Right now I’d say the gun rights people are winning,” said Helton, the eye doctor, with a laugh. “It’s because the federal government is hamstrung – a lot of states are just doing what they want.

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2...un-laws-states

[JAKIII]

Constitutional carry really should be the law of the land, although there are many who aren't responsible enough to handle it. It's like an elderly family member who is no longer 'able' to drive safely, but they don't realize it.

[PAMedic=F|A=]

Constitutional carry really should be the law of the land, although there are many who aren't responsible enough to handle it. It's like an elderly family member who is no longer 'able' to drive safely, but they don't realize it.

We still let them drive until they realize the problem.

I'll always choose more freedom.

[JAKIII]

We still let them drive until they realize the problem.

I'll always choose more freedom.

That's my point... they don't realize it. Ever try to take away grandma's car keys? It's painful for everyone.

[PAMedic=F|A=]

That's my point... they don't realize it. Ever try to take away grandma's car keys? It's painful for everyone.

Yep. Hand to do it to both my grandparent's recently.

But they are adults. They have to give them up, they can't be taken.

I've pissed off more than one nursing home nurse by refusing to take a patient to the hospital who did not want to go.

Sure they're old. Sometimes, they even should go. But I'm not kidnapping someone & no I don't care that their son is the Medical POA and says they have to....unless in my medical opinion, or documented legal/medical ruling of , incompetence they can refuse care.

So: Until grandma realizes she can not drive on her own, or commits a crime which warrants arrest or suspension of her driving rights....all you can do is ask.

[unclejumbo]

Yep. Hand to do it to both my grandparent's recently.

But they are adults. They have to give them up, they can't be taken.

I've pissed off more than one nursing home nurse by refusing to take a patient to the hospital who did not want to go.

Sure they're old. Sometimes, they even should go. But I'm not kidnapping someone & no I don't care that their son is the Medical POA and says they have to....unless in my medical opinion, or documented legal/medical ruling of , incompetence they can refuse care.

So: Until grandma realizes she can not drive on her own, or commits a crime which warrants arrest or suspension of her driving rights....all you can do is ask.

Actually, a doctor can (or may be required to report certain conditions) have PADOT suspend it or law enforcement officer can put them in for a special test which is a driving test. If they can't pass, they lose their license. Then PADOT sends out lift orders and PSP gets to run around and have those folks surrender their licenses to us.

[ungawa]

That's my point... they don't realize it. Ever try to take away grandma's car keys? It's painful for everyone.

I took away her vibrator. I thought it was a Tesla Coil.

[IronButt]

I took away her vibrator. I thought it was a Tesla Coil.

Robo-Cock?

[ungawa]

Robo-Cock?

No, not like a wiener. It had that big muffin thing on the top. I thought it was a Tesla Coil. I was going to vibrate my buddy's dead dog into a frankenstein monster.

[PAMedic=F|A=]

Actually, a doctor can (or may be required to report certain conditions) have PADOT suspend it or law enforcement officer can put them in for a special test which is a driving test. If they can't pass, they lose their license. Then PADOT sends out lift orders and PSP gets to run around and have those folks surrender their licenses to us.

Which is what I said. Legal or medical ruling