Likely outcome of Dickson City?

[FHL85]

After reading through all of 157 pages of comments on the PA Patriot arrested thread, I was wondering what the likely outcome of this incident will be. The police chief has said the incident is closed as far as his department is concerned. I do not see any chance that the Lackawanna county DA filing any charges against the officers. They work with LEO's on a regular basis and I feel they will not feel any pressure to charge them. I do not see the state or federal governments filing any charges unless there is a pattern of abuse at the local level One incident will not likely result in any action by those parties. That leaves a civil suit. Are there any lawyers out there who have experience in civil suits? Seeing the reactions of some of the locals on the posted videos, I am not sure that you could be assured of a large award. I have read many comments by PAFOA members talking about monetary damages etc, and the pessimist in me sees this possibly ending not with a bang but a wimper.

Please don't misunderstand me, I feel the LEO's acted illegally and should be punished, at least by the loss of their "part-time" jobs. However, I am not sure that even given a civil award of say $100K, nothing will change. Dickson City pays that out on a regular basis. Without a very large payout, the news will not get around the state/country and will not bring about any "schooling" of any police or the public.

As I am not a lawyer with civil litigation experience these are just my thoughts. I would be interested in hearing what such lawyers might say about the likelihood of a successful civil suit and the likely outcome of the suit.

Your thoughts?

[sjl127]

Only negative publicity and decreasing public opinion for open carry.

[Emptymag]

Since you brought up the matter of money, I'll say that the people I hear talking about "making money" from this incident, are those who were not involved in it.

Imagine how the whole thing must read to the antis who are reading this forum... The comments of a few make it appear that those involved are looking for a payday.

Personally, I think it's pointless to have a "what if" thread on this, as the outcome will not be based upon what we think.

[jcabin]

I was thinking about this the other day. If money is to be made from this incident, it would be in the form of an agreement, not to press criminal charges, but to fund a new program which in fact educates law enforcement in this state to the legalities and illegalities of CC, OC, and gun ownership in general. I think that would be appropriate.

[Pa. Patriot]

Only negative publicity and decreasing public opinion for open carry.

I've seen mostly the opposite. Even my "liberal" acquaintances are very supportive and think this is good for all Pennsylvanians rights.

We are already seeing good things come from it.

sjl127, what would you suggest to bolster public opinion on OC?

[DaveM55]

I've seen mostly the opposite. Even my "liberal" acquaintances are very supportive and think this is good for all Pennsylvanians rights.

We are already seeing good things come from it.

sjl127, what would you suggest to bolster public opinion on OC?

Not sjl127, but I would suggest working with the police and government instead of against them. No one will win from these confrontations no matter who's at fault.

IMHO, public opinion of all gun owners in general have been tarnished by this event. Just read the comments from those news paper articles.

What efforts have been made to work with Municipal Police Officers' Education & Training Commission (MPOETC)?

Mailing training memos may not have much affect on police training policies, face to face meeting would be another avenue.

Has anyone thought of talking with a PR person to consider other option?

[Pa. Patriot]

Not sjl127, but I would suggest working with the police and government instead of against them. No one will win from these confrontations no matter who's at fault.

The confrontation was not our doing.

IMHO, public opinion of all gun owners in general have been tarnished by this event. Just read the comments from those news paper articles.

Keep reading. Our side of the story has not yet been released

What efforts have been made to work with Municipal Police Officers' Education & Training Commission (MPOETC)?

Mailing training memos may not have much affect on police training policies, face to face meeting would be another avenue.

I agree. My training memos are not taken seriously. Sadly, we should not be responsible for "training" the police. But to not make an effort will default to the police learning the hard way, as in DC, and some will use that against us even though it is not our doing.

I also like the idea of the PR person/corp. Who wants to pony up the $ though, or can we get volunteer help in that area? Anyone have any leads?

[DaveM55]

The confrontation was not our doing.

Wasn't saying it was, and I should have stated that, sorry.
However, the public really doesn't care who started it. Some will blame you guys others the police. It's not the real issue at hand who instigated it.

Keep reading. Our side of the story has not yet been released

Then you are playing catch-up, public opinion is hard to change once they've heard any side of the story.

I agree. My training memos are not taken seriously. Sadly, we should not be responsible for "training" the police. But to not make an effort will default to the police learning the hard way, as in DC, and some will use that against us even though it is not our doing.

I also like the idea of the PR person/corp. Who wants to pony up the $ though, or can we get volunteer help in that area? Anyone have any leads?

Perhaps collecting money for a PR person would be better spent than for a legal fund defending law abiding citizens.

Action beats reaction.

[Pyrotek85]

IMHO, public opinion of all gun owners in general have been tarnished by this event. Just read the comments from those news paper articles.

The thing is, the media/politicians try to crucify gun owners every chance they get regardless, 'public opinion' was never on our side to begin with. I think that sitting idly can only make things worse. As they say, out of sight, out of mind. If the public isn't forced to think about gun ownership, it'll be that much easier for gun control measures to pass.

[larrymeyer]

DaveM55;

Have you tried to talk to your local PD and the surronding local boro's and towmships. In my experence they don't want to talk to a non-LEO they know the law better then you.

While none of us planned 5/9 now that it happened maybe other PDs will sit up and take notice. And do a little more training. If not them maybe the ADA who also didn't know the law.

Remember the officer who was there was offered a pamplet and refused it as he knew the law. Appearent he didn't his partner didn't the other police who showed up didn't, the ADA sidn't and the lawyers he called didn't. I'd like to knoe if he called his boss as well.