5.56mm x45mm proficient or puny man stopper?

[Crazy-c]

Hello everyone, I am a Infantry Officer in the U.S.Army and have a VERY serious question that I would like a very knowledgable person to answer. I have heard that the 5.56 is consider to be insufficient and does not incapacitate hostile targets and have heard stories of enemy combatants being shot mulitple times with 5.56 rounds and still being able to fire upon American forces and kill them! I have also heard that the 5.56mm is a extremely effective man stopper and is consider to be a "one hitter quiter". So as I new infantry officer who is about to go to combat for the first time, I would like to know just how effective is the 5.56mm x 45mm round is when it comes to stopping an enemy who is determined to kill you and you are trying to return the favorite. Allow me to thank you in advance for your response.


-Chris A. Fluellen
2LT, IN
U.S.Army

[Agent Smith]

First of all, I want to thank you for your service. We all appreciate what you guys do.

Personally, I'm one of the guys that think shot placement means more to stopping someone than caliber. Don't get me wrong, a larger round such as 7.62 x 51 definitely packs more of a punch, and is probably the round I would choose in most situations - especially for long range, but 5.56 is still an effective round.

[Kaos]

You're going to see alot of different opinions, but that round has been taking it to the enemy since the 60-70s, we wouldn't still be using it if it wasn't effective.

[Ophidian]

You're going to see alot of different opinions, but that round has been taking it to the enemy since the 60-70s, we wouldn't still be using it if it wasn't effective.

I don't know about that... look at the continued use of Digital Camo when much better alternatives are readily available.

[ungawa]

Most 5.56 projectiles will fragment when hitting flesh above 2700 feet per second causing horrible wounds. At close range, you should expect military 5.56 to be more effective than larger military rounds such as 7.62 - provided nothing slows down the bullet.

The effect is most pronounced under 150 meters. Anything that slows the projectile before hitting the flesh such as range, very heavy clothing, intermediate barriers (even wall board), or items carried on the target can slow the bullet below this threashold and then you just get a small hole (you also get increased penetration due to lack of fragmentation). But as previously stated, shot placement is king.

The older ammo (M193) fragmented more reliably. The newer M855 (green tip) that most military use for the M16 today fragments less reliably, especially against skinny people.

I would suggest you read all 4 sticky posts at the top of the ar15.com ammunition forum here:

http://ar15.com/forums/forum.html?b=3&f=16

Especially these three:

http://www.ar15.com/content/page.html?id=208
http://www.ar15.com/content/page.html?id=237
http://www.ar15.com/content/page.html?id=185

The ar15.com forum generally has some good info, but they are a little religious about it and may tend to ignore conflicting information. There are also some A-holes over there, just so you know.

The original AR-15/M16 was designed to be extremely light, spray bullets in controllable full-auto at close range, be very deadly at close range, but also have a medium to long range ability to at least hit a target. First they tried to turn it into a battle rifle and made the long and heavy A2. Now they tried to make it more handy with the M4, which lowers muzzle velocity. And, of course, the M855 ammo can be less effective under certain circumstances. As long as automatic fire is no longer considered a priority for the weapon, they should probably choose either a better caliber (preferably) or at least better ammo for the roles they envision for the weapon. I would think a squad with M16s and M249s should probably also have some .30 caliber weapons to fill the performance gaps of the 5.56 caliber. Some units are using M14s, but the weapon is a beast and there should probably be something new.

[ALS]

Ask the victims and the family's of those killed by the DC belt way snipers if the 55 grain .223 didn't pack a punch.

[TonyF]

LT,

Use every opportunity available to train your platoon in tactics and marksmanship. That is what will win fights and carry the day.

Only hits count. People I know "who know" say most engagements are occurring at about 35 yards. That's close enough to get accurate COM hits and for M855 to fragment.

[JoeWilliams]

It works just fine, LT. Plus, it's a breeze to hit with.

Be careful, and thanks.

[dogngun]

I first fired the M-16 and the "little .22" round in the Army in the late 1960's. I was first taught on the M-14, and have had some experience with both rifles.
The 5.56 has advantages, some of which are: it is very easy to learn to shoot, and very easy to learn to shoot well, even for someone who has never fired any weapon before.
It is very accurateeven at 300 meters or better.
It is light weight, and many rounds can becarried by the soldier.

It is a very good anti-personnel round when fired out of a long barrel - I don't care for a short barrel carbine , because IMO it does not provide enough velocity for this round.

It has been used and improved for over 40 years, and I'd bet on it to be around for a while yet.

Just my .02.

mark

[BenningBoy]

The logic, as it was explained to me, was that it wounded effectively, requiring a buddy or two to drag the one wounded to safety, taking out three enemy soldiers. That never sat well with me, but you are never going to find the perfect every situation gun/caliber. Placement is king. Good luck, and go easy on the enlisted, sir.