Private sale of rifles

**EvoRich** · February 19th, 2011, 11:11 PM

A friend of mine has owned firearms as a kid. He recently purchased a pistol for the first time. He was "put into research" but was approved to purchase the handgun. When he and another friend of mine were 16 years old, they were caught shop lifting as minors. Obviously this isn't enough to prevent firearm ownership. Their fingerprints were taken and I think this is why they're put into research but only to be approved. Same thing happened to the other friend when he went to buy a shotgun. Got on a 15 day wait but was approved.

He wants to buy an AK but doesn't want to deal with the 15 day wait period. Prvate sale of a rifle does't require an official transfer as far as I know. I know he is legally able to purchase and own firearm. Would I be breaking any laws if I were to purchase the gun and then sell it to him right away?

**JayBell** · February 19th, 2011, 11:41 PM

Originally Posted by EvoRich

A friend of mine has owned firearms as a kid. He recently purchased a pistol for the first time. He was "put into research" but was approved to purchase the handgun. When he and another friend of mine were 16 years old, they were caught shop lifting as minors. Obviously this isn't enough to prevent firearm ownership. Their fingerprints were taken and I think this is why they're put into research but only to be approved. Same thing happened to the other friend when he went to buy a shotgun. Got on a 15 day wait but was approved.

He wants to buy an AK but doesn't want to deal with the 15 day wait period. Prvate sale of a rifle does't require an official transfer as far as I know. I know he is legally able to purchase and own firearm. Would I be breaking any laws if I were to purchase the gun and then sell it to him right away?

yes, this a strawman sale.

you are buying it not for YOU, but for him, so he can evade possible waits for the law. You would be lying on the 4473 when you buy this.

tell him to get the PID # from the state police, or get teh legal issue cleared up.

strawman sales are a felony.

**PhillyAR** · February 19th, 2011, 11:54 PM

I second Jaybell's comment. However, once your friend with thru the extended time period for his first background check and passed, from now on they should go right thru.

**EvoRich** · February 20th, 2011, 12:22 AM

Originally Posted by PhillyAR

I second Jaybell's comment. However, once your friend with thru the extended time period for his first background check and passed, from now on they should go right thru.

I actually assumed that since he already went through the wait one time it may not happen again. I guess he'll have to try it and see. Thanks for the info guys! I figured it'd be legal, since he is NOT prohibited from purchasing and owning firearms, but then again it seems like a loophole, so I thought it may be illegal. Just wasn't sure.

Anybody know for sure if they see prior firearms purchases and bypass the 15 day wait? I'm getting annoyed because he wants an AK but just doesn't buy it because he doesn't want to wait. I just want him to buy it and shut the hell up hahaa.

**Snert** · February 20th, 2011, 08:39 AM

Originally Posted by EvoRich

I'm getting annoyed because he wants an AK but just doesn't buy it because he doesn't want to wait. I just want him to buy it and shut the hell up hahaa.

Umm, not for nothin; . But whay are YOU annoyed? if he is put into research due to HIS mistakes in life...Well thats his problem and has noone to blame but himself. So dont let it ANNOY you, not your fault or problem. Best you can do is tell him to manup and deal with it. And give him the info to aquire the firearms he wants without putting others in harms way of the law..And to do so in a legal manner, not a shaddy way.

Snert..

**EvoRich** · February 20th, 2011, 11:16 AM

Originally Posted by Snert

Umm, not for nothin; . But whay are YOU annoyed? if he is put into research due to HIS mistakes in life...Well thats his problem and has noone to blame but himself. So dont let it ANNOY you, not your fault or problem. Best you can do is tell him to manup and deal with it. And give him the info to aquire the firearms he wants without putting others in harms way of the law..And to do so in a legal manner, not a shaddy way.

Snert..

It's not the 15 day wait that annoys me. It's him not wanting to deal with it. If he just gets it over with, he doesn't have to wait as long. It's HIM that is annoying me haha. I told him, if he waits another month to buy it then it's a 45 day wait because he keeps putting it off. And usually it doesn't even take the entire 15 days anyway. The first time he went through it it ended up taking 5 days. My other friend waited 7 days. HE is the annoying aspect of this. I wasn't sure if it was shady or not, which is why I asked. I don't want to do anything illegal!

I let him know he just has to deal with it. And how do you get the PID#? Or vet the legal issues cleared up?

**Xringshooter** · February 20th, 2011, 05:58 PM

Originally Posted by EvoRich

Anybody know for sure if they see prior firearms purchases and bypass the 15 day wait?

Just because he went through research and got the okay does not mean that it won't happen again, or that he won't get denied the next time.

They DO NOT see prior purchases, they enter the PA DL # and the computers look to see if any disqualifiers come up. I have posted several times what "Research" actually means. Someone can get put into research if one of the computers that has been queried takes too long to respond.

It also doesn't matter if you bought a gun the day before, computer files are always getting updated and information that wasn't there yesterday could be there today.

As said, if you buy the rifle and immediately sell it to your friend, under the scenerio you posted, it would be a straw purchase as you would not be considered (by the police) as the actual buyer. You are buying to help someone possibly skirt the law.

**EvoRich** · February 20th, 2011, 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by Xringshooter

Just because he went through research and got the okay does not mean that it won't happen again, or that he won't get denied the next time.

They DO NOT see prior purchases, they enter the PA DL # and the computers look to see if any disqualifiers come up. I have posted several times what "Research" actually means. Someone can get put into research if one of the computers that has been queried takes too long to respond.

It also doesn't matter if you bought a gun the day before, computer files are always getting updated and information that wasn't there yesterday could be there today.

As said, if you buy the rifle and immediately sell it to your friend, under the scenerio you posted, it would be a straw purchase as you would not be considered (by the police) as the actual buyer. You are buying to help someone possibly skirt the law.

Thanks! I have heard of people with 100% clean records being put into research before. And I guess it's possible even with his juvenile record that he would possibly be approved right away. Luckily it's never happened to me, but I have a clean record.