Mental Health Catch 22: HELP!

**dragonofpa** · October 18th, 2007, 10:32 PM

Originally Posted by Chazman321

All he has to do is call the County MH/MR or MHA in the county he lived in at the time, and ask to talk to the MH?MR Administrator, or a Program Specialist. They're the ones that send the paperwork in to Harrisburg, and they should have it on file... But depending on the county, some never throw those records away, and some pitch them after 5 years... Just gotta ask...

If the cards are never thrown away, or if they are after 5 years doesn't the information stay on file with harrisburgh forever?

**Chazman321** · October 18th, 2007, 10:52 PM

Originally Posted by dragonofpa

If the cards are never thrown away, or if they are after 5 years doesn't the information stay on file with harrisburgh forever?

Yes it would. However, that doesn't mean it was entered into PICS. Only way you can find that out is to have him try to pass a PICS check. Or, if he's over 21, apply for a LTCF... Or, if you have any friends who are state troopers, see if they can run him through the system and see if anything pops up...

**dragonofpa** · October 18th, 2007, 11:03 PM

Originally Posted by Chazman321

Yes it would. However, that doesn't mean it was entered into PICS. Only way you can find that out is to have him try to pass a PICS check. Or, if he's over 21, apply for a LTCF... Or, if you have any friends who are state troopers, see if they can run him through the system and see if anything pops up...

Final question...

If PICS has a record of all this information but all hospitals, etc have destroyed the records due to age, will a challenge to a deniel end up with a removal of the disabilities within PICS?

**theSaj** · October 19th, 2007, 12:04 AM

I'd try for the juvenile records are sealed.

State no....if rejected, inquire. If they base it on your records at age 13. File a lawsuit against the state on how those records should be sealed. If they say they aren't criminal records so they don't have to be sealed. Then make the case that if they're not criminal then you shouldn't be treated like a criminal and have your rights as a citizen taken away.

**Chazman321** · October 19th, 2007, 03:10 PM

Mental health trumps criminal... Criminal is a behavior, mental is chemical. However, as the dude was 13 when it happened, I doubt he would have an problems. Try it, answer the question as no, and hold your breath... lol

If it's denied, then follow the steps I gave last time to have it nullified and all will be good...

Chazallthecoolkidsaredoingitman321

**mauser** · October 20th, 2007, 01:41 AM

If you answer "NO" on the form, and PICS shows "YES", could you be prosecuted for lying to try to purchase a gun?

**GunLawyer001** · October 20th, 2007, 08:26 AM

A denial based upon an involuntary mental health commitment at age 13 is very unlikely to result in a prosecution for lying on the forms. 13 year old kids don't know the details, they don't keep records. In fact, I'm not sure that anything other than a parent's instruction to "stay here and listen to the doctors" is required for a kid to be committed.

That being said, such a denial is a valid denial, and removing that prohibition is more complicated than just getting some letters from a new doctor. The procedure is set out in Title 18, Section 6105 (f)(1). In practice, a petition must be filed in the Court of Common Pleas, notice given to the PSP, and evidence of a recent psych evaluation MUST be placed into evidence. The PSP will challenge every one of these petitions, so that a court hearing will be held and evidence will be presented (without a challenge, the judge could just grant the motion without ever setting eyes on the petitioner.)