"Illegal database"

[Metz]

What's "sales" database? Who maintains it? If there is a database then there should be a server, there is should be a software, there should be an admin and data entry people. Who's paying for that?

[B2Luv2Hunt]

What's "sales" database? Who maintains it? If there is a database then there should be a server, there is should be a software, there should be an admin and data entry people. Who's paying for that?

The State Police. They are to be destoryed but they do not do that.

[HiredGoon]

What's "sales" database? Who maintains it? If there is a database then there should be a server, there is should be a software, there should be an admin and data entry people. Who's paying for that?

It's the info from the form that you fill out when you buy/transfer a gun at a FFL gun dealer.

From the PA Uniform Firearms Act:

TITLE 18 PA CRIMES CODES

§6111. Sale or transfer of firearms.

<SNIP>

(v) Unless it has been discovered pursuant to a criminal history, juvenile delinquency and mental health records background check that the potential purchaser or transferee is prohibited from possessing a firearm pursuant to section 6105 (relating to persons not to possess, use, manufacture, control, sell or transfer firearms), no information on the application/record of sale provided pursuant to this subsection shall be retained as precluded by section 6111.4 (relating to registration of firearms) by the Pennsylvania State Police either through retention of the application/record of sale or by entering the information onto a computer, and, further, an application/record of sale received by the Pennsylvania State Police pursuant to this subsection shall be destroyed within 72 hours of the completion of the criminal history, juvenile delinquency and mental health records background check.

<SNIP>

(1.3) In addition to the criminal penalty under section 6119 (relating to violation penalty), any person who knowingly and intentionally maintains or fails to destroy any information submitted to the Pennsylvania State Police for purposes of a background check pursuant to paragraphs (1.1) and (1.4) or violates section 6111.4 shall be subject to a civil penalty of $250 per violation, entry or failure to destroy.

[thundrr1]

I see Cavmedic's point. It could be an issue of semantics with the police, as they still love to use the "permit"word. We know that they don't know all the gun laws.

A person holding a C&R could clear this up. Call the local gestapo and ask them to check a serial number for a pistol that was sent directly to you, under the guise of wanting to buy said weapon. If your really ballsy, use a weapon you already own. I'll think that over.

[knight0334]

I think those are 2 different things.

1. The NCIC stolen gun database (legal)

2. The PA State Police sales/transfer database (illegal)

With the thing with NCIC is too, many departments across the nation enter a gun into that database if they take possession of the firearm whether you are guilty or not. The NCIC is misused as well, but nothing near like PSP's database.

[Metz]

The State Police. They are to be destoryed but they do not do that.

So they use our monney to run it? I'm not big on laws and stuff, but isn't there a lawyer in the house? Why no one took legal action yet? Those are taxpayers' money, for the love of God, that are financing illegal anti-taxpayer activity! Not to mention, in the time of economic crysis.

[Steve in PA]

With the thing with NCIC is too, many departments across the nation enter a gun into that database if they take possession of the firearm whether you are guilty or not. The NCIC is misused as well, but nothing near like PSP's database.

You can't enter a firearm, or anything else into the NCIC database unless it is lost or stolen.

[41 Redhawk]

So they use our monney to run it? I'm not big on laws and stuff, but isn't there a lawyer in the house? Why no one took legal action yet? Those are taxpayers' money, for the love of God, that are financing illegal anti-taxpayer activity! Not to mention, in the time of economic crysis.

It was challenged in court by, I believe, the Allegheny County Sportsman League. The PA Supreme court ruled that it was not a registry and therefore legal because it does not contain all handguns and handgun owners; only those that have purchased a handgun since PICS was established.

[knight0334]

You can't enter a firearm, or anything else into the NCIC database unless it is lost or stolen.

I'll PM you the SN# of my 1911A1 this weekend, give it a check. The last time I had a LEO friend run it it came back as being in there, not as lost or stolen but with some sort of notation.

[Nullifidian]

It was challenged in court by, I believe, the Allegheny County Sportsman League. The PA Supreme court ruled that it was not a registry and therefore legal because it does not contain all handguns and handgun owners; only those that have purchased a handgun since PICS was established.

That doesn't make sense. That's NOT what the law says. The law says ANY record of ANY sale entered into the PSP database must be deleted within 72 hours of the completion of the background check. It doesn't say "you can't keep a database" it says you can't hold any records of any sales for more than 72 hours after you complete the background check.

The background check is complete BEFORE the purchaser (or transferee) takes possession of the firearm. So 72 hours after the purchaser takes possession of the firearm, by law, there MUST be no record of the sale. It says it plain as day:

"an application/record of sale received by the Pennsylvania State Police pursuant to this subsection shall be destroyed within 72 hours of the completion of the criminal history, juvenile delinquency and mental health records background check."