Is Olympic Arms ignorantly prompting customers to commit federal felonies?

[-JD-]

[ETA]: I just want to point out that I am specifically using "ignorantly" in an neutral/literal sense meaning simply "uninformed" on this specific issue. This can be a convoluted issue with lots of contradictory information floating around. I mean to cast no general aspersions on these folks.[/ETA]

I just got their latest email ad-letter and this is (partly) what was included:

The K22P

Sister to the K23P, this AR15 pistol is sure to turn jealous heads!



Having more options is always better. The K22P gives its owner lots of options!

Manufactured with a 6.5" 416 SS button rifled match-grade barrel this is a surprisingly accurate pistol. It is threaded with standard mil-spec 1/2x28 tpi threads and comes outfitted from the factory with a standard A2 flash suppressor.

First the obvious; this is a pistol, not a rifle or carbine. More than that, it is an AR15 pistol, fully interchangeable with all other standard AR15 upper receivers and parts. having been build on a standard AR15 lower receiver, the K22P can take other uppers such as the 6.5" barreled pistol caliber uppers (9mm, 40 S&W, 10mm, and 45 ACP). It can also house the OA93 (no recoil tube necessary) or the K23P upper with the short recoil tube out the back.

But more than that, as is allowed under federal law, this pistol, as with any pistol, can be legally converted into a rifle/carbine configuration (requires a minimum 16" barrel and buttstock assembly), and back into a pistol again, any time you like.

Whether you make any changes at all, or just shoot the K22P as is for all it's lifetime, you are in for a FUN, EXCITING, and INEXPENSIVE day at the range for everyone in the family.

MSRP: $895.70: Ships with ballistic nylon pistol assault case, and one 28 round Blackdog Magazine. Lifetime Warranty, 60 Day Satisfaction Guaranty -Proudly Manufactured in the USA.

Bold-red-underline mine.

I've been taught that this is a big time no-no. Once the stock goes on, no more pistol! It stays a rifle - forever (barring NFA paperwork and tax.) Attaching a sub-16" barrel means "making" an SBR.

Think the BATFE will give the customers a pass because "the manufacture said it was OK!"?

[Gun Bowanna]

Well then, this'll blow your mind. Check these puppies out.

http://www.mechtechsys.com/


I think you got it wrong.
Pistol to Rifle is Okay, Rifle to pistol is nah-ah.

[Wiley-X]

Nope, you can turn a pistol into a rifle, providing the barrel is of an appropriate length and then back again.

You cannot turn a rifle into a pistol without paperwork and then since it is now an SBR, you can turn it back into a rifle without fuss or muss.

The law always permited this but ATF got their knickers in a twist back in the 90s over a conversion kit that Thompson Center sold. You could turn the Contender into a carbine with this kit but ATF claimed that having the kit and a Contender gave you an illegal SBR. The Supreme Court said that it was okie-dokie as long as the buttstock and the pistol barrel were not on at the same time.

[-JD-]

[snip]Once the stock goes on, no more pistol! It stays a rifle - forever[snip]

[snip]
Pistol to Rifle is Okay, Rifle to pistol is nah-ah.

We are both right.

[G23neverjams]

Well then, this'll blow your mind. Check these puppies out.

http://www.mechtechsys.com/


I think you got it wrong.
Pistol to Rifle is Okay, Rifle to pistol is nah-ah.

i think i leaked some maple syrup on that site..... so i could buy one of those, put my Glock 23 frame on it and it's legal to do that in PA?
GOD BLESS THE USA FOR THIS ONE

[GunLawyer001]

What a lot of people miss about Short Barreled Rifles is that they include more than stocked rifles with barrels under 16"; they also include rifles with barrels over 16", but with overall length under 26"; and they ALSO include any weapon made from a rifle that has an overall length under 26".

Since most pistols are under 26", that means that almost any pistol made from a rifle requires NFA registration and tax.

[Gun Bowanna]

i think i leaked some maple syrup on that site..... so i could buy one of those, put my Glock 23 frame on it and it's legal to do that in PA?
GOD BLESS THE USA FOR THIS ONE

Yep,They're Legal in PA.

[mrnyman]

Nope Bob Schultz is a good man he doesnt want you to go to Jail, its perfectly legal as long as its sold as a Pistol, it doesnt matter what the ATF thinks- its the law.

Nyman

[GunLawyer001]

Nope Bob Schultz is a good man he doesnt want you to go to Jail, its perfectly legal as long as its sold as a Pistol, it doesnt matter what the ATF thinks- its the law.

Nyman

Well, no it isn't.

Yes, the pistol can be sold like this. And it could even be sold, like that Thompson-Center kit, with a receiver, a short barrel, and a long barrel and buttstock. That would be legal, as a kit.

But the Supreme Court never said anything about what the effect of making it into a rifle would be, so there's no case law that overrides the plain language of the National Firearms Act, which uses these definitions:

18 U.S.C. § 921
. . .
(7) The term "rifle" means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned and made or remade to use the energy of an explosive to fire only a single projectile through a rifled bore for each single pull of the trigger.

(8) The term "short-barreled rifle" means a rifle having one or more barrels less than sixteen inches in length and any weapon made from a rifle (whether by alteration, modification, or otherwise) if such weapon, as modified, has an overall length of less than twenty-six inches.

In other words, if you start with a pistol, and REMAKE or REDESIGN it into a rifle, then you have a rifle, and you can't ALTER or MODIFY that rifle into anything under 26" in OAL without filing a tax-paid Form 1 and waiting for approval.

[Wiley-X]

So your assertion is that once you put a carbine top onto your 1911, you can't take it off again? If that's really the case, wouldn't ATF Enforcement be slavering to get at all these people making pistols out of "rifles"?