Please help with my first NFA purchase (suppressor)

[bac0nfat]

Mods, feel free to move this thread if it belongs in another forum.

Right now I am trying to buy a .22 suppressor, either a TAC65 or a Gemtech Outback. I have all the money on hand to make the purchase and pay the tax stamp, and right now I am just trying to jump through all the hoops and get through all the red tape. I went to my local police chief to get the signature, but he will not sign. He said "I don't have a problem with you owning a suppressor, and I actually think suppressors are pretty cool, but I just have a problem with the liability of signing your form." I assured him that there was no liability but he would not budge with his decision. Now I am considering going to the sheriff. The sheriff in Montgomery county was known to never, ever sign any of the form 4's, but he died last week. So do I try to talk to the new sheriff, who is probably swamped with things to take care of in the transition? Or, do I take the trust route and pay a lawyer $500 to $600 to form a trust? I have already considered using quicken or legalzoom to create a trust, and I just don't feel comfortable with the risks involved in creating an invalid trust. Please help!

[bogey1]

if your self-employed, and incorporated, you dont need a sign off or prints. just sign on the dotted line.
the only down fall is if your company gets sued, the weapons are part of it, and if you ever go out of business, you have to start from square one, in other words, you have to have them transferred to you, another 200.00 each and sign offs, prints ...........
someone with more knowledge than me will be here shortly.

[bac0nfat]

Well I just called the sheriffs office, and they said "we dont sign those." So I guess I'm stuck now. Anybody know of someone in Montgomery county that will sign, before I go the trust route? DA, or judge?

[Asmodeus]

Why not just do an LLC? Online service with the PA Department of State, $125, and about a week later you have your LLC paperwork in hand.

[bac0nfat]

Why not just do an LLC? Online service with the PA Department of State, $125, and about a week later you have your LLC paperwork in hand.

Okay, you have my attention! I guess it's just a little intimidating because I know nothing about it. Do I have to do anything to keep it valid every year? I really dont want to do anything that will require any sort of maintenence, or cost me yearly fees, or anything like that. I know that a trust always exists without any further paperwork or fees, which is why I was leaning towards that. Basically what I'm asking is,

1. Can I form an LLC on my own, without a lawyer?

2. Can I form an LLC to purchase the item, and then just forget about it for the rest of my life and have it always be valid?

[Kramer]

Okay, you have my attention! I guess it's just a little intimidating because I know nothing about it. Do I have to do anything to keep it valid every year? I really dont want to do anything that will require any sort of maintenence, or cost me yearly fees, or anything like that. I know that a trust always exists without any further paperwork or fees, which is why I was leaning towards that. Basically what I'm asking is,

1. Can I form an LLC on my own, without a lawyer?

2. Can I form an LLC to purchase the item, and then just forget about it for the rest of my life and have it always be valid?

No yearly fee in P.A. but that could change in the future. You have to file taxes yearly, basic nothing fancy, if you go S-Corp (Fed 1120-S) file no loss or gain, P.A. you can file RCT-101-I Inactivity report to show no loss or gain.

[bac0nfat]

Okay thanks for the responses guys. I decided to go the trust route. I have an appointment with a gun trust lawyer on thursday, and I just placed the order for the suppressor. Its gonna be 6 weeks to get the suppressor to the dealer and then I can start the paperwork. I will keep updating this thread with my experiences as I go through this whole process!

[WhiteFeather]

Mods, feel free to move this thread if it belongs in another forum.

Right now I am trying to buy a .22 suppressor, either a TAC65 or a Gemtech Outback. I have all the money on hand to make the purchase and pay the tax stamp, and right now I am just trying to jump through all the hoops and get through all the red tape. I went to my local police chief to get the signature, but he will not sign. He said "I don't have a problem with you owning a suppressor, and I actually think suppressors are pretty cool, but I just have a problem with the liability of signing your form." I assured him that there was no liability but he would not budge with his decision. Now I am considering going to the sheriff. The sheriff in Montgomery county was known to never, ever sign any of the form 4's, but he died last week. So do I try to talk to the new sheriff, who is probably swamped with things to take care of in the transition? Or, do I take the trust route and pay a lawyer $500 to $600 to form a trust? I have already considered using quicken or legalzoom to create a trust, and I just don't feel comfortable with the risks involved in creating an invalid trust. Please help!

I missed this post, if your chief of police doesn't have the problem with signing other than the liability factor. I would demonstrate there is none, with an internet search the info is out there, the one that comes to mind if I recall the details correctly is a police officer in Ohio murdered a drug dealer with an M-11. Family took the police chief to court and was ruled there was no liability or no way of knowing that by the signing a form 4 would have been known in advance a crime.

This is also one of the rare cases where anyone was murdered using a registered NFA device.


I would do the research / prove the no liabilty factor to police chief vs getting into a trust deal, but to each their own, bad legal trust advice can cost lots more if you get the wrong one.

Also offer the chief a chance to shoot a few rounds after it comes in, a little freindly persuasion couldn't hurt either.

an option is you can also get a local sitting judge to sign the form 4, rare but its another way if you know a judge that would be willing.

By the way you will like your TAC 65 if that is what you end up getting.

[Nate7667]

Just a suggestion on which can to get.
If you go with the TAC65, it can be taken apart to be cleaned by you. The Outback is a sealed suppressor and has to be returned to Gemtech for cleaning at your cost. You have to buy the disasembly tools for the TAC, but only pay one time. And then you can clean it when ever you want.
The Outback seems to be more quiet than the TAC65. But the "disasemble ability" really comes down to how much you plan on shooting it, im talking multiple thousands of rounds.
Neat idea, weigh the can when you get it, then weigh it again after a year to see how much lead build up has accumulated.

[Dragracer_Art]

I have a TAC65... and I'm actually thinking about buying another one.

You can't go wrong with either can... but the benefit of being able to open and clean the TAC65 is a pretty big plus.