Do the Feds flag you if you buy too many guns...

[arjohnson]

Maybe that says something about those dealers?? The ones I frequent have told me they rarely get checked. ..only the occasional random inspection and when something had to get traced.

I also know a dealer who had all his 4473 taken by ATF because they did'nt have time to do it in the store. They returned them at a later date, this was a stand up dealer and no BS was going on, and they were not there to trace a gun.

[reverserboy]

They do random checks of FFL's, if they see your name in the books alot for certain types of guns they will take your info. This I know for a fact, you can dispute it til your blue in the face. I know many dealers personally that have told me this, and one of them is where I get my guns shipped to.

THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I've been told also if they see a name selling & buying a lot, at different dealers,they may get interested.

[Xringshooter]

The point is they do random checks.

Sure they do, that's the compliance divisions job, to make sure the FFL's are doing all the required paperwork correctly.

I've held my license for 21 years now and I have had BATFE compliance inspectors in my shop 3 times. The compliance agents all called before hand to set up a date and time for the inspection, they checked my books, found a few small errors (which they allowed me to fix on the spot), looked around the shop (easy to do it's only 10x12), I showed them how I kept my personal stuff separate from the business stuff, and they left.

BTW, if the compliance agents notice or find stuff that is grossly incorrect or suspicious, they will take their findings to the enforcement side and then a full blown investigation will begin.

I've had the enforcement division agents at my shop twice, once to ask about a multiple handgun gun sale (it was some S&W 422's and 622's for a firearms instructor and everything was good to go) and once while doing a trace investigation on a certain gun (I showed them where I got the gun from and who it was sold to and that was that, never heard anything more about it). They also called before hand and set up an appointment.

I hear all these second, third and fourth hand stories about how the BATFE went into a place and shut them down because they forget to dot an i or used the wrong abbreviation on "one or two" forms I look at those "reports" with a jaundiced eye because of my experiences with them (BATFE) and the friends I have made over the years in many different police organizations. The background info I was given if I asked about a rumor (and I was never told anything that would compromise a case), showed that if a place was raided, it was for good reason. 99.9% of the time that someone had the BATFE come knocking with a warrant, it was justified.

[archangel689]

The source of information was probably not from some secret gov database.

I myself was interviewed by an fbi investigator because a friend of mine needed a raise of his security clearance. They tried to interview every friend he had. Odds are one of the individuals they interviewed told the investigator about the weapons that he had. The individual in question has a particular fondness of the CZ-75 and I think that was briefly mentioned in the interview.

A friend of mine was considered for a position with the FBI last year and during one of the interviews the interviewer asked him about his guns.

He then proceeded to ask him why he owns an AK-47 and an AR-15, without being told that he did in fact own those weapons.

He then mentioned how impressive his handgun collection was.

My friend's impression of the discussion was not negative, he said the interviewer seemed genuinely interested in "talking guns" with him. However, it is obvious based on this exchange that the feds at least have the ability to determine what weapons you own. How exactly, I don't know, but apparently they can.

Whether there's a flag for having "too many", I don't know, but the idea that they don't know what you have is not very plausible to me anymore.

[JayBell]

per the OPs question. yes, they do... but not so much buying too many guns, but buying too many HANDguns.

I know of 2 people persoanlly that got visits form teh ATF based off the multiple handgun sale records that FFLs must turn in.

if they suspect suspicious purchases, they will come by and talk to ya... in both cases, the guys were clean, one guy would buy a pistol, shoot it, decide he didn't like it, trade it in on something different... sometimes 3 times a week... he kept all his receipts tho, so when the ATF showed, he pulled his file out and said: "Oh yeah, i bought this, but the hammer bit, so i traded it in on this, but it wasn;t accurate, so i traded it in on this, which was OK, but the trigger sucked, so i traded it in on this...." and on and on... after about 10iterations of that the ATF guy looked at the file of receipts, looked at him, and said "Sorry for bothering you sir" and beat feet

the other guy came into a massive accident injury settlement, and was buying everything cool in sight... he just showed them the receipts and said "yup, All MINE!" and they left.


so yeah, they DO flag you based on too many purchases

[das]

What about the Obamas Homeland security. I read in (Time or Newsweek I forget.) that the Czar of one of these agencies can put individuals that seem to buy guns for what ever reason, collecting,hunting or just range shooting can be put on the "Domestic Terrorist" list. Even if you buy large quantities of ammo you may be put on the list. If its actually occurring I dont know but it was a reputable news source that reported it. Im suprised no one has heard or mentioned it.

[reverserboy]

Sure they do, that's the compliance divisions job, to make sure the FFL's are doing all the required paperwork correctly.

I've held my license for 21 years now and I have had BATFE compliance inspectors in my shop 3 times. The compliance agents all called before hand to set up a date and time for the inspection, they checked my books, found a few small errors (which they allowed me to fix on the spot), looked around the shop (easy to do it's only 10x12), I showed them how I kept my personal stuff separate from the business stuff, and they left.

BTW, if the compliance agents notice or find stuff that is grossly incorrect or suspicious, they will take their findings to the enforcement side and then a full blown investigation will begin.

I've had the enforcement division agents at my shop twice, once to ask about a multiple handgun gun sale (it was some S&W 422's and 622's for a firearms instructor and everything was good to go) and once while doing a trace investigation on a certain gun (I showed them where I got the gun from and who it was sold to and that was that, never heard anything more about it). They also called before hand and set up an appointment.

I hear all these second, third and fourth hand stories about how the BATFE went into a place and shut them down because they forget to dot an i or used the wrong abbreviation on "one or two" forms I look at those "reports" with a jaundiced eye because of my experiences with them (BATFE) and the friends I have made over the years in many different police organizations. The background info I was given if I asked about a rumor (and I was never told anything that would compromise a case), showed that if a place was raided, it was for good reason. 99.9% of the time that someone had the BATFE come knocking with a warrant, it was justified.

I see you're in central PA. Would it be possible that dealers in eastern PA would get looked at more because of the potential of more straw buying being closer to NJ & NY??

[Xringshooter]

I see you're in central PA. Would it be possible that dealers in eastern PA would get looked at more because of the potential of more straw buying being closer to NJ & NY??

Sure, it's always a possibility that the ATF will look closer at dealers around big cities and those near states that have draconian gun laws because of the possibilities of more illegal goings on. This would probably happen especially if they were getting a lot of multiple gun sales forms from the dealers located near the big cities or places that have a lot of gang activity.

[BandanaBandit1]

My question was directed to Kramer, although the answer to your question is a simple one. Any of the following could suggest an excess of guns:

1. Inadequate interior volume remaining in one's home for breathing space. Forget moving between rooms.
2. When finished cleaning the last gun, the first 100 are rusted and the next 100-200 are in dire need of dusting
3. The police call you when there's a serious gun fight.
4. Hornady, Winchester, CCI and Remington poll you to decide what ammo sizes they're making next year.
5. If you bought a gun from a gunshop, only to realize you used to own it years ago.
6. If your local gunsmith calls you for obsolete parts.
7. If your gun safe is bigger than your refrigerator.
8. If the FBI asks you to identify firearms they can't.
9. If you have guns in your safes that you can't for the life of you remember how you came by.
10. If ammo manufacturers had to layoff workers when you went to Europe for a month's vacation.
11. If third world arms dealers consider you to be the largest gun runner in the world (but you keep all the stuff for yourself)
12. If you've spent more money at Midway USA, Brownell's, and Cabela's than the companies are worth.

Oh my god, do i have to worry if i am subject to some of those on the list? lol.