Trouble In Philly

[Drylok]

We over at illinois carry heard you boys were having some trouble in Philly. I was searching this site to see what you guys are saying about this but couldn't find it. If this is a double post feel free to delete this.
Is Philly the equivilant of Chicago here? Pretty anti 2A it seems hu?

http://whyy.org/cms/news/uncategoriz...-florida/29849

For the past year, Philadelphia police officers have noticed a disturbing trend. More and more people with prior arrests or known criminal behavior are getting concealed weapons permits from Florida, and carrying their guns around Philadelphia streets.. Lieutenant Lisa King runs the gun permit unit for the Philadelphia Police.

King:"Police officers are stopping these guys that they know in the district that are real dirtbags and they have a permit to carry from Florida. And they'll confiscate the permit and send it to us. And we'll send a letter to Florida, but just from like phone conversations they'll be like, well we don't revoke for that. And we'll be like…OK.."

King says Philadelphia can reject applicants for their character and reputation. She says the majority of the 23,000 Philadelphians who do have permits to carry concealed weapons are law-abiding, and cause no problems.

But through an interstate reciprocity agreement, its perfectly legal to turn to Florida, if Philadelphia rejects an application.

Joe Grace is executive director of Cease Fire P-A, a gun control organization.

Grace: "The issue here is people who can't get a valid permit to carry a concealed firearm in Pennsylvania then by mail order, literally, can get a permit from the Florida Department of Agriculture, get a permit and be able to carry a concealed weapon in Pennsylvania. We think that just does not make sense."

Grace says the state Attorney General's office needs to revise its interpretation of the reciprocity agreement.

[mrjam2jab]

Over here...

[JIDinPhilly]

Somebody posted something about that yesterday. I think it is discussed in the pafoa blog.

[BimmerJon]

Welcome!

The stupidity in this, is that bad guys don't NEED anything in order to carry a firearm. I'm starting to think cops really believe criminals won't acquire, steal or buy a firearm to commit a crime, unless they can get a LTCF....lmao

Yo man, wanna go get a gun, shoot up someone's house, rape a girl and murder her boyfriend?

Nah dude...I don't have a LTCF.

Ah crap, me neither... Oh well... let's go help out down at the homeless shelter and then go to church instead.

[Pro2A]

We over at illinois carry heard you boys were having some trouble in Philly. I was searching this site to see what you guys are saying about this but couldn't find it. If this is a double post feel free to delete this.
Is Philly the equivilant of Chicago here? Pretty anti 2A it seems hu?

http://whyy.org/cms/news/uncategoriz...-florida/29849

For the past year, Philadelphia police officers have noticed a disturbing trend. More and more people with prior arrests or known criminal behavior are getting concealed weapons permits from Florida, and carrying their guns around Philadelphia streets.. Lieutenant Lisa King runs the gun permit unit for the Philadelphia Police.

King:"Police officers are stopping these guys that they know in the district that are real dirtbags and they have a permit to carry from Florida. And they'll confiscate the permit and send it to us. And we'll send a letter to Florida, but just from like phone conversations they'll be like, well we don't revoke for that. And we'll be like…OK.."

King says Philadelphia can reject applicants for their character and reputation. She says the majority of the 23,000 Philadelphians who do have permits to carry concealed weapons are law-abiding, and cause no problems.

But through an interstate reciprocity agreement, its perfectly legal to turn to Florida, if Philadelphia rejects an application.

Joe Grace is executive director of Cease Fire P-A, a gun control organization.

Grace: "The issue here is people who can't get a valid permit to carry a concealed firearm in Pennsylvania then by mail order, literally, can get a permit from the Florida Department of Agriculture, get a permit and be able to carry a concealed weapon in Pennsylvania. We think that just does not make sense."

Grace says the state Attorney General's office needs to revise its interpretation of the reciprocity agreement.

King is full of shit... I had to go thru a lot more crap to obtain my FL non-resident then I did to obtain my PA resident. If anything I think it'd be harder to get a FL non-resident permit. They wanted everything but my first born. I would gander that they simply don't like people carrying on non-resident permits. I know of people who carry on non-resident permits in PA...

[GunLawyer001]

. . . people with prior arrests or known criminal behavior are getting concealed weapons permits from Florida, and carrying their guns around Philadelphia streets.. . . .

Neither "prior arrests" nor "known criminal behavior" are legitimate grounds for a denial, although a pending criminal prosecution would be.

The way the system is SUPPOSED to work is that "prior arrests" get prosecuted by competent police and the DA, in adequately funded and staffed courts, with judges who are not political hacks who obtained their seat by coming up with the right amount of campaign money (I read that in the Inquirer, and if the Inquirer says bad things about their beloved Democrats, I suspect that it's true) and the guilty are convicted; THEN you can deny someone for that CONVICTION. You can indict a ham sandwich, that doesn't make that sandwich a criminal.

The police don't get to make up their own rules to compensate for the inadequacy and incompetence of the Philadelphia criminal justice system. Every person is presumed to be innocent unless convicted. An arrest is not a conviction, neither is "known criminal behavior", unless what the cops "know" is presented in court and results in a conviction. If the cops can't get a conviction based on the rumors and hearsay, then they didn't "know" it well enough, did they?

The Philadelphia PD is essentially saying that they leave so many criminals free to walk the streets and commit more crimes, that it would be ineffective to limit any list of "criminals" to the ones that they managed to catch and convict. I actually agree with that premise, but my conclusion from that is that even the little people, who are neither cops nor politically connected, need to protect themselves from all those unconvicted criminals that the government can't manage to corral.

I'm pretty sure that Florida rejects applications for permits using pretty much the same criteria that most of the other PA counties use, instead of being pissed that they have to issue the things and looking for any excuse to reject law-abiding citizens.

The reason that Philadelphia residents have to use alternative means to protect themselves is because the crooked Philadelphia government ignores existing PA law.

[GL23]

I sent the following e-mail to the writer.......

Susan,
I just read and listened to your story regarding the Florida permits in Philadelphia. It was one sided and lacking any comment from the other side. Did you attempt to contact any pro gun organizations for their perspective on the issue? Are you interested in doing any type of follow up with input from the pro gun side? I would welcome the opportunity to provide you with that information.

Thank You,

gunlawyer, you actually took the words right out of my mouth. Is it ok if I use some of that in my reply to her if she contacts me?

[GunLawyer001]

. . .

gunlawyer, you actually took the words right out of my mouth. Is it ok if I use some of that in my reply to her if she contacts me?

Go right ahead, I'd be pleased if it helps.